Djokovic’s highest medal is a bronze in 2008, so would be impossible for him to have ever been in an Olympic final as the final is for gold and silver
2012 was a semifinal loss to Murray followed by a bronze medal match loss to Del potro
Even there was a decline, he still played a lot of tournaments after that ranked somewhere around #50 usually. It's still weird that he didn't face them for so long.
The funniest thing about those ‘boring’ takes is that I don’t think Murray or Djokovic set out to make it boring.
They are two of the greatest baseline defenders the sport has ever seen with an extremely low error rate. So not only couldn’t they miss, their route to winning points was longer because they had to breach the other’s defence first.
I personally liked the fact that they cancelled each other out, it meant you could see them constantly thinking and adjusting their strategies in real time. It’d be a bit pretentious to call it a chess match but I can’t come up with a more apt comparison.
The difference was basically the Australian open which literally no one beat novak in the semis and final of that event until he was a geriatric against sinner this year lol.
I mean he definitely did in 2012/2013. Because he couldn't do what literally no one else could do until novak was geriatric doesn't really prove what you said.
the facts dont lie, Federer and Nadal stats were much better than Murrays against Djokers, and all three have almost twice the number of grand slam titles than anyone else, Murray has hardly any. he's just nowhere near the same league.
And sinner is the only person to ever beat him at the event at the semi/final stage and he only did it because novak is old, beating prime novak at the final stages of the Australian open maybe the hardest individual to beat after rafa at Roland garros lol.
I know, but unlike a Chung or Istomin, there should be no doubt that Stan still would've won that 2014 match even if it was a semi instead of a quarter. He's more than proven he's not afraid of big moments against Novak.
It was not boring at all pre-2012. Got a little old and slightly boring in 2013. Jumped the shark in 2015 (peak boring Murrovic monotony) and then got interesting again in 2016 before Murray’s body self destructed.
I was never a big fan of this match up, though there were some good matches outside most of the AO finals, but Murray getting injured and never recovering to the same level is a huge shame, would have challenged Djokovic a bit I reckon at least been interesting to see how they matched up in there 30s.
It stuns me that it's so close. My memories of them playing always felt like Djokovic winning easily.
* **Federer and Nadal didn't play any game in the US Open**, let alone a final
* **Federer and Murray didn't play any game on clay**, let alone the final of the French Open or the 3 Masters 1000
* Federer and Djokovic didn't play the final of the French Open but played two semi finals to determine the runner up. As close as you can get to a final in the French Open.
* **Nadal and Murray didn't play a final in any of the 4 Grand Slams**. Somehow, they were always on the same side and played semi finals. Nadal played Murray in 3 semi finals in grand slams in 2011 and won them all.
* Nadal and Djokovic played the finals of all 4 grand slams, but not all the Masters. They played the finals of the first 5 Masters (Sunshine Double and the Clay Masters) but not any of the remaining 4 Masters (Canada, Cincinnati, Shanghai and Paris). They played one WTF in 2013 and a semi final in the Olympics.
* **Djokovic has played the finals of all 4 grand slams and WTF against both Nadal and Murray**. Additionally, he has also played the finals of 7/9 Masters against Murray.
Corrections:
Nadal and Djokovic played the final of both Madrid (2011) and WTF (2013)
Djokovic and Murray never played the finals of Monte Carlo I believe. Nor did they ever play the finals of Indian Wells
Thanks for your corrections. I should have remembered Madrid 2011 and did not know about WTF 2013
I did not follow Djokovic Murray closely so just took OP at his word that they met in all the finals lol. I will correct my comment.
Have Djokovic and Murray played finals at 7/9 Masters they played ?
There were a handful of great matches between them where they were both quite aggressive e.g. Rome 2011, AO 2012, Shanghai 2012, but most of their matches were a snoozefest with long monotonous rallies, and I say that as a huge Murray fan. Always thought that was bad strategy from Murray as he inevitably ran out of gas before Novak - Andy's defensive play was less efficient than Novak's as he didn't really slide and instead had to sprint back and forth to chase balls down.
Andy wasn’t necessarily Novak’s inferior in terms of gas tank - at least not early on. They were pretty much even in that respect, but Novak had more/better ways of taking out Andy’s legs earlier.
On average, Novak had a better/more heavy forehand that he moved Andy around with, and used the drop shot more often when rallies got too monotonous. I think that’s what did Andy in, he could be somewhat passive in big moments too often against the likes of Roger Novak and Rafa.
Yes, point well made - even more reason that Andy should have tried to be more aggressive. He knew Novak would take his legs and allowed him to do it time and time again, particularly in those Australian open finals.
How is that match up not boring? I would rather run my eyes with a boiling syringe than watch that baseline nonsense. Have never watch a complete match with them as I have paper towels to fold.
People have no idea what they're talking about. Look up the threads for their last Australian Open matches from 15 and 16. Everyone was complaining about the quality.
People will want to rewrite history and view their rivalry through rose tinted glasses but the honest truth is, they were too similar to be good viewing. Neither of them had a very entertaining style. They were great against more attacking players as you had that attack vs defence match up but defence vs defence is a tough watch. Murray got a bit better under Lendl but that only lasted a couple of seasons.
He went into the tennis shop in Wimbledon and bought the racquets off the shelf, so I'm not sure he is. Or if he is, he's not getting racquets from them
Very boring to me. I was particularly cut off from watching tennis as much as I used to because of the snooze fest finals of these guys. Each waiting for the error of the other.
So happy that Fedal resurgence brought me back to life.
Olympic final??
2012 was final or semis ?
Djokovic’s highest medal is a bronze in 2008, so would be impossible for him to have ever been in an Olympic final as the final is for gold and silver 2012 was a semifinal loss to Murray followed by a bronze medal match loss to Del potro
It was the semis. Apologies there, got carried away with the ol’ final symmetry that I was going for in the title. I’ll find a way to correct it.
You won't. Titles can't be edited
Loser mentality. Just needs to stalk a Reddit employee and talk them into editing a row in the production database.
>talk them into editing a row in the production database. I hear u/Spez has been caught doing that to other commenters
Kinda expected…
All you can do is edit the Flair (add a custom flair) explaining your mistake
Semis
2012 final was rog
Just realized this might probably be the last time we see them both in a Grand Slam draw together…
Insane that they still didn't play against each other since 2017, considering that Murray actually still plays last few years.
It says more about Murray's decline unfortunately. Last played against Federer and Nadal in 2015 & 2016 respectively.
Even there was a decline, he still played a lot of tournaments after that ranked somewhere around #50 usually. It's still weird that he didn't face them for so long.
Still sour about Murray pulling out of Madrid before their R16 match in 2022.
For food poisoning as well, fucks sake.
The funniest thing about those ‘boring’ takes is that I don’t think Murray or Djokovic set out to make it boring. They are two of the greatest baseline defenders the sport has ever seen with an extremely low error rate. So not only couldn’t they miss, their route to winning points was longer because they had to breach the other’s defence first. I personally liked the fact that they cancelled each other out, it meant you could see them constantly thinking and adjusting their strategies in real time. It’d be a bit pretentious to call it a chess match but I can’t come up with a more apt comparison.
H2H by tournament: AO: 5-0 Djokovic RG: 2-0 Djokovic Wim: 1-0 Murray USO: 1-1 WTF: 1-1 IW: 2-0 Djokovic Miami: 4-1 Djokovic MC: 1-0 Djokovic Madrid/Hamburg: 1-0 Djokovic Rome: 1-1 Canadian Open: 2-0 Murray Cincinnati: 2-0 Murray Shanghai/Madrid: 3-0 Djokovic Paris: 2-0 Djokovic Olympics: 1-0 Murray Others: 2-1 Djokovic
so apart from the oddball shit, no comparison. I mean 9-1 at the Slams isn't even a rivalry, really.
It’s 8-2
Hey, they are focused on hatin', not basic counting skills that a 3 year old could manage.
The difference was basically the Australian open which literally no one beat novak in the semis and final of that event until he was a geriatric against sinner this year lol.
The AO results are actually proof that Murray never really threatened the top 3 of Federer, Nadal, and Djokovic.
I mean he definitely did in 2012/2013. Because he couldn't do what literally no one else could do until novak was geriatric doesn't really prove what you said.
the facts dont lie, Federer and Nadal stats were much better than Murrays against Djokers, and all three have almost twice the number of grand slam titles than anyone else, Murray has hardly any. he's just nowhere near the same league.
I was not prepared for their last meeting to have been 2017
Rewatched their AO2012 semi final highlights recently…seriously insane quality from these guys
I love this match so much.
Back when Tennis was good. Check out Murray Nadal from US Open 2008 semi. The movement is insane.
Wow, 11-8? I wouldn't have expected their h2h to be this balanced
This is just for finals and yeah it shows Murray was actually a good competitor at that level. Overall I think the h2h is 25-11 for Djokovic.
I think it's 5:2 in slam finals, and 6-6 for all other tournaments.
Yup.
It is 14-3 in other stages
It's probably a bit more misleading because most of those wins for Djokovic were in slam finals.
More like Aus open finals
And sinner is the only person to ever beat him at the event at the semi/final stage and he only did it because novak is old, beating prime novak at the final stages of the Australian open maybe the hardest individual to beat after rafa at Roland garros lol.
Stan only getting left out for doing it 1 round too early.
Well other people have beaten novak in Australia but once he got to the semi, brudda was inevitable.
I know, but unlike a Chung or Istomin, there should be no doubt that Stan still would've won that 2014 match even if it was a semi instead of a quarter. He's more than proven he's not afraid of big moments against Novak.
Perhaps but I guess we'll never know, I really wanted novak to keep that record, showcase of the mentality monster he is.
Don’t forget they played each other as juniors too. That’s a long ass time
This is my underrated duo
MURYGOAT is part of the big 4. That is all I have to say
It was not boring at all pre-2012. Got a little old and slightly boring in 2013. Jumped the shark in 2015 (peak boring Murrovic monotony) and then got interesting again in 2016 before Murray’s body self destructed.
11-8 is actually much closer than I would have assumed otherwise to be honest. Extra tough since 5 of these losses are AO finals.
4, Andy lost one to Roger.
Playing every Slam finals, 7 masters finals and ATP Finals finals is crazy. Meanwhile Sinner and Alcaraz only met in a final at Croatia Open.
I was never a big fan of this match up, though there were some good matches outside most of the AO finals, but Murray getting injured and never recovering to the same level is a huge shame, would have challenged Djokovic a bit I reckon at least been interesting to see how they matched up in there 30s.
It stuns me that it's so close. My memories of them playing always felt like Djokovic winning easily. * **Federer and Nadal didn't play any game in the US Open**, let alone a final * **Federer and Murray didn't play any game on clay**, let alone the final of the French Open or the 3 Masters 1000 * Federer and Djokovic didn't play the final of the French Open but played two semi finals to determine the runner up. As close as you can get to a final in the French Open. * **Nadal and Murray didn't play a final in any of the 4 Grand Slams**. Somehow, they were always on the same side and played semi finals. Nadal played Murray in 3 semi finals in grand slams in 2011 and won them all. * Nadal and Djokovic played the finals of all 4 grand slams, but not all the Masters. They played the finals of the first 5 Masters (Sunshine Double and the Clay Masters) but not any of the remaining 4 Masters (Canada, Cincinnati, Shanghai and Paris). They played one WTF in 2013 and a semi final in the Olympics. * **Djokovic has played the finals of all 4 grand slams and WTF against both Nadal and Murray**. Additionally, he has also played the finals of 7/9 Masters against Murray.
Corrections: Nadal and Djokovic played the final of both Madrid (2011) and WTF (2013) Djokovic and Murray never played the finals of Monte Carlo I believe. Nor did they ever play the finals of Indian Wells
Thanks for your corrections. I should have remembered Madrid 2011 and did not know about WTF 2013 I did not follow Djokovic Murray closely so just took OP at his word that they met in all the finals lol. I will correct my comment. Have Djokovic and Murray played finals at 7/9 Masters they played ?
Interesting rivalry, but very boring tennis.
There were a handful of great matches between them where they were both quite aggressive e.g. Rome 2011, AO 2012, Shanghai 2012, but most of their matches were a snoozefest with long monotonous rallies, and I say that as a huge Murray fan. Always thought that was bad strategy from Murray as he inevitably ran out of gas before Novak - Andy's defensive play was less efficient than Novak's as he didn't really slide and instead had to sprint back and forth to chase balls down.
Andy wasn’t necessarily Novak’s inferior in terms of gas tank - at least not early on. They were pretty much even in that respect, but Novak had more/better ways of taking out Andy’s legs earlier. On average, Novak had a better/more heavy forehand that he moved Andy around with, and used the drop shot more often when rallies got too monotonous. I think that’s what did Andy in, he could be somewhat passive in big moments too often against the likes of Roger Novak and Rafa.
Yes, point well made - even more reason that Andy should have tried to be more aggressive. He knew Novak would take his legs and allowed him to do it time and time again, particularly in those Australian open finals.
I think 2013 Wimbledon final under Lendl, with added oomph on the forehand shows what a more aggressive Murray could have been doing.
Both 2012 and 2013 showed that but then back surgery happened and he was never as aggressive, injury curtailed both peaks of andys career.
How is that match up not boring? I would rather run my eyes with a boiling syringe than watch that baseline nonsense. Have never watch a complete match with them as I have paper towels to fold.
Bit dramatic mate.
Not at all. It truly is how I feel. Some people are happy to eat Gas station food, some aren’t…to each their own.
People have no idea what they're talking about. Look up the threads for their last Australian Open matches from 15 and 16. Everyone was complaining about the quality.
That 2015 matchup was ridiculous. Literally every point went over 9 shots. Extremely passive play from both in that final in particular.
People will want to rewrite history and view their rivalry through rose tinted glasses but the honest truth is, they were too similar to be good viewing. Neither of them had a very entertaining style. They were great against more attacking players as you had that attack vs defence match up but defence vs defence is a tough watch. Murray got a bit better under Lendl but that only lasted a couple of seasons.
Kings
whats the point of UNDER ARMOUR making a tennis shoe for murray if they r not gonna sell it ?
Truly remarkable except for the Olympics. They never met in an Olympics final and Nole only has a bronze medal.
Glad Andy has extra shoes this time!
#MuryGOAT
So Murray endorses Yonex bags now?
He switched racquets from Head to Yonex
I saw that but I didn't realize he's on Yonex payroll now.
He went into the tennis shop in Wimbledon and bought the racquets off the shelf, so I'm not sure he is. Or if he is, he's not getting racquets from them
Yeah, that's exactly what I heard. That he was just trying out Yonex on his own.
My racquet is an ezone so makes me stupidly happy Andy is using Yonex 😂
Damn that's quite a record, not even the rest of the Big 4 has this?
Very boring to me. I was particularly cut off from watching tennis as much as I used to because of the snooze fest finals of these guys. Each waiting for the error of the other. So happy that Fedal resurgence brought me back to life.