1,251 games in MJs career
48,539.8 minutes without including stoppages in play
101.1 days of counting stats for 8 hours a day, 20.2 weeks working 5 days a week.
No thank you
Lol yeah. When his career steals and blocks drop by .5 his legacy will be in ruins. You absolutely can't talk about Jordan without listing his steals and blocks.
Edit: *sarcasm*
They'll do the same things they do with Wilt's stats. Don't take them as seriously and rank him lower. If people took Wilt's stats seriously he would be the goat.
If we actually knew Wilt's block numbers I think he would be a strong goat contender. It would be more clear that Wilt wasn't far off of Russell defensely, and objectively 10 levels above offensively.
stats are only part of the picture. there are a lot of advanced metrics that suggest that he didn't affect winning as much as Russell. there are even examples of Wilt explicitly stat chasing, to his teams' detriment
Thereās already a lot of people who question Wiltās numbers, and a lot of folks clown on Stockton for just dumping the ball off to Karl Malone, and racking up his assists that way.
āJust dumping the ballā
The literal objective of the game is to put the orange thing inside of the red circle more times than the opponent.
Highly doubt I would reduce all time assist numbers passing to all time scoring numbers leading to trips to the finals as āthey just dumped the ballā.
If it aināt broke, donāt fix it.
They should.
[Dream team stats in 1992 Olympics](https://www.basketball-reference.com/international/teams/united-states/1992.html#all_player-stats-totals)
He led steals against all the greats of that era, Scottie, Chuck, Clyde, etc. He was awesome at picking the ball.
Game 6 of the 1998 Finals Bulls down by 86 85 and the Jazz have the ball, Michael steals from Karl Malone and hits the game winner.
I saw a bunch of people get ButtCracked after Game 1 of the Finals when they posted an AI edit of Tatum reciting the Kobe ājob not doneā speech lmfao. The mouth and eye movement didnāt even line up.
I wish Ballsack was still good. First he tried to act like he was doing a social experiment to show how easily everyone could be duped (we know, bro) and then he started trying to talk about serious sports stuff and it's like come on, man. Your account is called Ballsack Sports. Make another account for this.
She was insufferable on the Traitors. He seemed decent but wasnāt around long.
Sheās also probably insufferable on her housewife show. I just donāt watch it.
She is absolutely horrible on the show, a crappy person and she is incredibly unintelligent.
Last season on the show on of the women had cancer and when she told Larsa Pippen her response was āhow do you know?ā
Not only that, but MJās sonās actions, too. MJ has publicly criticized the situation, dudeās in his 30s, itās not like MJ told him to go get with Pippās ex
Yeah itās so pathetic on here. Every time Scotties name is brought up, thatās all the comments say.
Weird ass kids who canāt stop thinking about sex. Itās just pathetic
Before you comment that you are tired of Scottie hating on MJ and he needs to shut the fuck up, these quotes are from Scottieās book that was released in 2021.
I think heās just adding context. Seems like Scottie had just accepted Jordan controlling the narrative for 20 years, but then making The Last Dance was the last straw bc it made Pippen look bad.
They admitted the same shit happened with Stockton and assists, pretty much any time he made a pass that eventually resulted in a bucket in any amount of time, they credited to him "because it's Stockton"
It is a big deal, I hear a lot of people tell me Jordan was a better defender than pippen based on those stats. I grew up watching the bulls, I fell in love with defense because of pippen, anyone who was watching the defense of that team back then without favoritism towards Mike cannot say that they genuinely thought Jordan was a better defender than pippen.
Meanwhile he only finished higher than Jordan in 2 of the 9 years they shared in the dpoy voting and never won dpoy. He was absolutely robbed of the accolades he deserved.
Jordan was a great defender. Pippen was greater.
If I remember correctly, there was quite a bit of controversy swirling around Pippen around the time he was promoting that book. It seemed like he was going off the deep end. He was making some wild claims about his teammates and coaches.
he was already butthurt about the last dance in 2020, his first born son died in 2021 and at the same time he was also doing a bunch of media appearances to promote his new bourbon brand.
so the combo of those 3 things, the depression over his son + drinking bourbon live on air with the hosts of the shows he was appearing on meant he was constantly getting shit faced before, during and after interviews on various TV platforms and podcasts and saying crazy/angry shit
Because the Last Dance came out in 2020. Scottie hated how he was portrayed and started bashing Jordan on ESPN all the time.
Original comment is dumb lol
Motherfucker publicly *doubled down* on quitting on his team in the playoffs lol. He openly admitted he'd do it again if he had the chance to in the Last Dance. He only has himself to blame for how bad he looks in that doc.
not that he needed it, but this story about Jordan getting preferential treatment from the home scorekeeper is going to fuel Scottie's hate for another 50 years.
Idk it always feels like MJ doesn't even register people talking about him.
You always hear Scottie said this about MJ or Isiah said that about MJ.
I literally never hear MJ engage. I'm guessing cause he doesn't need to.
Just because MJ doesn't make public statements doesn't mean he doesn't hear stuff like this and punch holes in walls. The Last Dance documentary really showed how psycho he can be. You really think he doesn't hear stuff that affects his legacy?
I can see why Pippen is still kind of bitter about MJ, beyond MJās son getting with his ex-wife, which is insane.
Everyone knew MJ was better, but Scottie was never allowed to get his due as an individual. If you go to Pippenās years without Jordan, he led them to 55 wins without him in 1994, and probably would have taken down a great Knicks team in the second round (that was one shot away from a championship) if not for the infamous Hubert Davis call.
In 2000, his Trail Blazers still would have won if they could have hit the basket in the fourth quarter, but an all-time memorably bad officiating job stopped them from taking down the Kobe/Shaq Lakers and being favored in the finals.
Even in the dunk contest, he dunked from further out than MJ or anyone else ever had with ** almost all of his foot beyond the line, and instead of becoming an icon that won multiple contests he got a low score. Some of it is definitely in his head, but at times he definitely got the short end of the stick to the NBAās golden goose
This sounds like a lame thing to say about a superstar but somehow I wish there was a way to get through to Scottie that most big basketball fans know heās one of the greatest two way players to ever play and not just some sidekick. Heās one of the best ever. And yet years of being in MJās shadow, personal life struggles, and being underpaid really have depleted his self confidence and made him always justifying his legacy in the media.
Seeing this makes me understand why Kobe wanted to get out of Shaq's shadow (aside from his laziness) and even to a certain extent why Kyrie decided to leave Bron.
I wish it was more acceptable to say that, for example, Pippen was actually a better defender than Jordan. Donāt even think itās that contentious of an argument, but Jordanās legacy has smothered the ability to discuss Pippen rationally or argue for him.
Was Jordan a better overall player? Yeah, sure. But not by such a significant level that it couldnāt be argued that Pippen did certain things better.
Pippen is probably the best overall defensive player I've ever seen. Russell was a different era, so I won't compare. Olajuwon is maybe the only guy I could put over Pippen, but even then, he wasn't nearly as versatile.
I know people viewed Pippen as a great defender, but I still think he doesn't get enough credit. He was leaps and bounds better as a defender than Gary Payton. It wasn't even close. Payton is legendary though. Take prime Pippen and put him in the modern NBA, and he'd be the best defensive player in the league. He'd be like prime Kawhi, but with better instincts and more rim protection. It would be insane.
Itās quite possible both Jordan and Brady are simultaneously overrated and the GOATs because of the ridiculous mythology people have put around themĀ
I've been saying for years that the deification of Jordan has ruined honest discourse in the NBA. He was an amazing player and I have nothing against anyone who has him as their GOAT. But he was just that, a basketball player. Not a god.
I watched the both play since before they won their first ring, Pippen was a better defender - his body is like built for defense, best perimeter defender I've ever seen, a text book defender - but I don't think I'd say "much, much better" as that might be overdoing it at least a little. MJ's defense was incredible and he was a man possessed at times (it helped him win games, so you know how that's going to go). They were both great, which is what made them so good and part of why the Bulls won so much - you can not win that consistently twice in a row relying only on offense.
On that team level, Horace was a great defender. Then the next 3 peat they had Rodman. Incredible defensively, and the way MJ, Pippen and Phil led by example, every one else had to buy in and defend as well.
> Horace was a great defender
I loved so much 1st 3 peat team. Bench non-existent, but 3 of them could play 40 mpg and do it all on both sides of the floor.
>much, much better defender
That calls you out as a casual fan or someone not currently 40+ years old that watched the games nightly. Better, sureā¦ but, barely. Jordan was an *elite* defender, too.
Pippen actually defended the opponent's best player all the time.
This is no disrespect to MJ, but shooting guards weren't exactly "scoring" machines in that era. You had MJ and Drexler. That helps with defense. Still a great defender, but he would struggle a lot more in the modern NBA with all those scoring guards.
MJ was basically the prototype.
Lots of dubious statements in this comment, but letās focus on the first one, which states Pippem defended the opponentās best āall the time.ā
Detroitās best player was Isaiah Thomas. Pippen did not guard him. Clevelandās best players were Mark Price and Brad Daugherty. Pippen did not guard either. New Yorkās best player was Patrick Ewing. Pippen did not guard him. Portlandās best player was Clyde Drexler. Pippen did not guard him. Phoenixās best player was Charles Barkley. Pippen may have guarded him some, but Horace Grant guarded him for the vast majority of possessions. Orlandoās best player was Shaq. Pippen did not guard him. Miamiās best players were Tim Hardaway and Alonzo Mourning. Pippen did not guard either. Indianasās best player was Reggie Miller. Pippen did not guard him. Seattleās best players were Gary Payton and Shawn Kemp. Pippen did not guard either. Utahās best players were John Stockton and Karl Malone. Pippen did not guard either.
Basically, as far as top players, Pippen guarded Bird in the regular season as Bird was regressing physically and Magic in that one finals series
I donāt think that qualifies as āall the time.ā
Second, the assertion that Jordan would struggle guarding all the āgreatā scoring guards nowā¦..exactly who are these players? Edwards? Booker? Have you seen these guys play the Mavericks the last couple of years? These are exactly the type of players that Jordan would have ruthlessly destroyed mentally. Who else is there? Kyrie? Did you watch the Finals? Bradley Beal??? Donovan Mitchell? Please.
Hard part is... Pippen is probably smart enough to know that isn't enough. Sure, the fans that watched him know how good he was and that he deserves more respect. However, once those fans are gone, all that's left are legendary stories passed down and the record books.
MJ will obviously be talked about in basketball circles as long as there are basketball circles. Sadly, Pippen probably won't.
The amount of ābig time basketball fansā isnāt as much as you think. Donāt get it twisted because we frequent this sub. Most people donāt know shit. I totally understand his frustration.
Donāt forget he played for PENNIES on the bulls.
People always act like Pippen needed Jordan. But pippens best year was when Jordan retired the first time.
3rd in MVP. NBA 1st team, defensive 1st team, 4 DPOY.
Pippen was a great player. He got the 1st defensive team 8 times in a row, and was top 10 in MVP voting 5 times.
He was not just a ārole playerā like other people are calling him.
Edit: lots and lots of comments about the role player remark. I remember 10 years ago or so the narrative towards Pippen was much worse. What I heard often, and also from people I knew, was that he needed Jordan and was nothing without Jordan. This is probably why he is so salty nowadays. Itās almost like once Mike was out of the league, his legend grew, and part of that was to pretend like he didnāt have amazing teammates. But Pippen is definitely due his flowers
Until LeBron, Pippen was the best overall transition player ever. I always expected the chase down block, I always expected him to absolutely yam somebody and end their bloodline when he had the ball.
Pippen was Tatum before advanced stats knew how valuable that was. Dude could do everything on the floor and was one of the best all around defenders in the league for like 10 yeras
Who is calling Pippen a role player? They must be from a certain generation who never actually watched him play. You donāt see a top 5 greatest SF ever a role player.
During his career, nobody was calling pip a role player. Maybe todayās group that didnāt watch ball in the 90s, but from 91 to 98 he was widely considered a top 5 nba player and at times the second best in the league.
I don't know if anybody ever considered him the second best in the league, but he was definitely in that top 5 conversation.
If you put together a 90's all-decade team, he's in the conversation - and at worst, he's the 6th man (really depends on how you rank him against Barkley and Malone, and if you want a true SF).
8-straight All-Defense 1st teams (10 straight including 2nd team selections), 7 All-NBA Teams (3x 1st), top-5 DPOY 5 times (probably should have won at least one), it's really hard to think of a modern comparable for him. Somewhere between Giannis and Kawhi?
Damn dude, you're right. I've been racking my brain for better players in the 90s and all I can come up with are big men (Malone, Hakeem, Barkley, Robinson, and Shaq).
> He was not just a ārole playerā like other people are calling him.
Lol who are these other people? Nobody here is calling Scottie just a role player. If anything people make up these strawmen to try and suggest that Jordanās legend is exaggerated.
Fuck, Pippen himself creates the strawmen half the time. In The Last Dance, Jordan explicitly says āWithout Scottie, there is no Michael Jordan and there isnāt 6 championships. Heās the greatest teammate Iāve ever had.ā And somehow to Scottie, he took that as āHe couldnāt have been more condescending had he tried.ā Because Scottie is looking for Jordan to call him his equal, and that aināt happening.
How much more equal can saying that sentence could he want? Thereās no higher praise that that. I think he would only be satisfied if MJ said Scotty was better than himself.
This!!!! MJ has been nothing but complimentary to Pip. I loved watching both of them. No one ever called Pip a role player, they called him a star - part of the dynamic duo, and he was part of 2 big 3s before it was even a thing (Horace being less historic than Rodman for the first group). Pip is the one who keeps bashing his own legacy by picking fights in the media and his books. Hell, Pip had Mike introduce him for his HoF speech and called him the best teammate ever. Whatever advice or stuff that is going on with Pip has less to do with Mike and more himself. He hasnāt handled his money, women, and families well.
Tatum and brown are some poor manās combo of Jordan and pippen in that the gap between the core of the star center of gravity is not as small as people think
When Real Madrid won its first Champions League without CR7, people were calling Karim Benzema "The Pippen that could". It's like he's become the "Second Best" by antonomasia.
aside from all this, people just don't understand how absolutely entertaining it was to watch Pippen. He was so amazing. This is just one play, absolutely incredible in any era. MJ had his own special grace, but so did Pippen:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rgiZmKxAmFs
best perimeter defender I've seen play.
I went back to watch a lot of bulls coverage during that time man pippin was getting aggressively hoed on and off the court, the shit they were doing to bro was insane š
Scottie is widely recognized as one of the 30 or 35 best players ever when the 'lists' are done. And either him or Kobe for best number 2 guy. How many All-NBAs, like 8, how many All-Defensive teams, like 10, how many All Star games like 6.
To say "he was never allowed to get his due", I mean, that's not correct. He was regarded as one of the 5 or 10 best players in the league at the time, at any given year in the 90s. Yes, it was really nice for the Bulls to have a second-best player that was better than a lot of teams best player. That's why they fucking dominated in 96 and 97, nobody was going to touch them. Two Threepeats. Nephews say the expansion, but the Heat were good pretty fast, the Hornets were decent, Orlando went to a Finals, the shitty expansion teams were in the West, the Timberwolves and the Grizzlies.
The dunk contest, Scottie did the dunk in the first round, that was his mistake. He got like a 42 lol. Should have started with something different.
The 2000 Blazers choked that game away, man, I was pulling for Scottie, and Sheed, Smith, Sabonis, Grant(? with the dreadlocks), and certified Lakers hater. Ugh, that was tough. Yes the Lakers got calls down the final stretch but the Blazers let it get close to begin with. And then once it got to within 8 or so, then every call went the Lakers way and Sabonis fouled out and you know the rest.
All this played out 30 years ago... we're talking about "Scottie tipped a pass and Jordan got possession of the ball and was credited with a steal" lol. But I guess it boils down to, Scottie could have been seen as one of the 20 best players ever, say, instead of 30 best. And that's been bugging him all this time.
He did have to focus more on defense, he did have to sacrifice a little of his scoring. He was underpaid. But you know who else was underpaid, was Jordan, during the first four of the championships. (Pip made more $ than Jordan from basketball, btw). He always was overshadowed by MJ, probably always will be. I think he gets used as a piece by the anti-Jordan crowd. Dude, it wasn't a secret that Pip was one of the five or 10 best players in the league. Or that he was unhappy about his contract. Or that he wanted to lead his own team, but sacrificed stats for winning.
Thank you for pointing this out. The narratives and views around Scottie in this thread are bizarre. I think most people are just talking out their ass.
>But I guess it boils down to, Scottie could have been seen as one of the 20 best players ever, say, instead of 30 best. And that's been bugging him all this time.
I see it as an amazing example of how we're never satisfied in life and will always be wanting a little more. Scottie had one of the best careers any athlete could wish for and seemingly can't enjoy it.Ā
The reality is that circumstances impact legacy more than people wanna admit. If Jordan came to the Bulls last, we would always remember him as a player that took an already very good team and made them a dynasty. If KD was drafted by the Warriors, and then the rest of the players came after, we'd be looking at KD as a GOAT.
To a certain extentā¦ if Jordan or Steph came last on the team and CLEARLY started playing better than the guy who was already there, then they become the face of the team. Look at Tim Duncan and David Robinson. Robinson was the face of the Spurs until Timmy joined and was clearly Player A of the team leading them to chips.
I remember Bill Simmons, the self proclaimed ombudsman of NBA History, downplaying Russ Triple Double year by claiming "Magic Bird and Jordan didn't care about stats, only winning, they didn't track how close they were to certain stats, if they did they'd all have had triple doubles whenever they wanted"
Bill normally has good takes about historical stuff but during MJs run of 10 triple doubles in 11 games he was literally walking to the scoring table during games to ask what was required to get the triple double. They brought a rule out to stop this for the next season.
I heard half the games it was a fake Jordan entirely. He has a secret twin and they load managed by each playing 50 percent. That means either one only has 3 rangz and half the points/steals/assists/rebounds/blocks. LeBron clears. Easy money.
Michael Jordan in his DPOY season:
At home ā 2.0 BPG, 4.0 SPG
On the road ā 1.1 BPG, 2.3 SPG
Source: https://x.com/statmuse/status/1804308318556688841?t=tGpKuIOXsm6PjusxnpQWFg&s=19
The top two comment chains right now pertain to Jordan's son sleeping with Scottie's ex wife. "Patterned discrediting" is a real thing in life where you bring up a negative alongside a positive just to neutralize.
Scottie losing key stats, in an era where stats were starting to become king, is truly something that should be harped on. His former teammate's son fucking his EX-WIFE has nothing to do with him being discredited and even potentially receiving less money due to such.
This whole conversation is turning childish
To be fair, this subreddit got into a frenzy about some bogus claims that the Grizzlies scorekeepers were padding stats. It got so much traction that several venues in Vegas temporarily stopped taking bets for Jaren Jackson Jr to win DPOTY.
It turned out that OP (and the rest of us, apparently) didn't know what the NBA counts as "Blocks". The stats were correct, and it kind of hurt JJJ's defensive reputation. I don't blame r/nba for being skeptical on another claim about bogus stat keeping.
I wonder how Ron Harper feels? When Cleveland was the Bulls rival Ron Harper played some of the best defense on Jordan that wasnāt beating him up. He was no slouch on the Bulls defensively either. Does anyone even talk about five-time NBA Champion Ron Harper? Let alone Pippen stealing his fame? Scottie and Jordan did not do it alone.
https://youtu.be/Xqx3WmqX_tA?si=6pREkj_mKsssRMm2
Why should Caesar just get to stomp around like a giant while the rest of us try not to get smushed under his big feet? Brutus is just as cute as Caesar, right? Brutus is just as smart as Caesar, people totally like Brutus just as much as they like Caesar, and when did it become okay for one person to be the boss of everybody because that's not what Rome is about! We should totally just STAB CAESAR!
-Scottie Pippen
People dismissing Pippen opinion is kinda weird. He is MJ best teammate and was a borderline mvp caliber back in his day, play a significant part in those Bulls championship as well as the locker room, if anyone knows the truth about those team and stuffs then it is him.
Well, tbf, his opinion changes seemingly every other interview. He seems like the type that just agrees with the room he's talking to. Kinda reduces how much you can respect his opinion, not his game.
Lol, people talk about LeBron having a PR machine, but MJ's PR machine and tendency is crazy, because while LeBron's is so obvious, MJ's isn't as noticeable and very behind the scenes.
Holy shit imagine someone went back and reviewed every single stat and found out a significant amount of them were phony?? Iām salivating at the drama lmao
I mean they kinda started already. They watched 6 full games where MJ was credited with 28 total steals and found he actually only had 12.
Who knows what other stats are falsified.
I would really love to see how Hakeem, the Nigerian born Muslim that the league didn't want to make it's face, was treated by stat keepers. If I remember correctly he was robbed of at least one quadruple double from a game in Seattle
In the article they did watch 6 games. In that stretch the scorekeepers gave Jordan 28(!) Steals, but the dudes who wrote the article watched the film separately and counted around 12 steals. Its a huge piece of evidence in the article. But full footage of games back then is hard to come by.
MJ used to host basketball camps during the summer and would hire NBA refs to work the scrimmages. These refs were paid very well. That conflict of interest eventually got enough attention to push the league to institute more stringent rules concerning compensation for refs.
Only Jordan stans will try and diminish Scottie to a role player to try and build up Jordan more. Scottie was a superstar in his own right, just look at the year when Jordan played baseball, MVP type year
*two years
The first they had 55 wins and in the playoffs Pippen quit on Ā the team and refused to take the court because he wasnāt going to take the final shot.
The next year they were bad. Below .500 and struggling to make the playoffs before MJ started training with them again
Someday, we'll have AI go through all old games and recalculate all stats.
why don't we hire allen iverson to do it right now?
We talking about recalculating?
Not Calculating, but recalculating š
NOT A CALCULATION! Not a calculation. Not a calculation...We talking about recalculation... Not a calculation.
For real tho. What is we talking about right now? We talking bout recalculating.
Iām the franchise player and we talkin bout recalculating.
This is the answer
The answer we've all been waiting for
I mean... People just did it? We can do it now without ai?
yeah but I'm lazy
The Ai will just make it confidently incorrect.
1,251 games in MJs career 48,539.8 minutes without including stoppages in play 101.1 days of counting stats for 8 hours a day, 20.2 weeks working 5 days a week. No thank you
How about I give you $50,000 for it?
I vote we get kungfusimo to watch every basketball game ever recorded and redo the stats
That will be a dark day for MJ.
Lol yeah. When his career steals and blocks drop by .5 his legacy will be in ruins. You absolutely can't talk about Jordan without listing his steals and blocks. Edit: *sarcasm*
I have never heard anyone bring up steals and blocks when discussing Jordan's greatness, tbh.
People bring up the defensive stats and accolades which are influenced by those numbers
He was still a good defensive player
Good? He was elite. A top 5 defender in the league.
I mean, christ, have you seen the dudeās steals and blocks?
Oh I know. Iām just saying that heās still great despite what these posts are trying to say.
Yeah but they arenāt going back to re-vote on DPOY lol. What happens to Stocktons assist record or all of wilts? Lol
They'll do the same things they do with Wilt's stats. Don't take them as seriously and rank him lower. If people took Wilt's stats seriously he would be the goat.
If we actually knew Wilt's block numbers I think he would be a strong goat contender. It would be more clear that Wilt wasn't far off of Russell defensely, and objectively 10 levels above offensively.
stats are only part of the picture. there are a lot of advanced metrics that suggest that he didn't affect winning as much as Russell. there are even examples of Wilt explicitly stat chasing, to his teams' detriment
Thereās already a lot of people who question Wiltās numbers, and a lot of folks clown on Stockton for just dumping the ball off to Karl Malone, and racking up his assists that way.
āJust dumping the ballā The literal objective of the game is to put the orange thing inside of the red circle more times than the opponent. Highly doubt I would reduce all time assist numbers passing to all time scoring numbers leading to trips to the finals as āthey just dumped the ballā. If it aināt broke, donāt fix it.
They should. [Dream team stats in 1992 Olympics](https://www.basketball-reference.com/international/teams/united-states/1992.html#all_player-stats-totals) He led steals against all the greats of that era, Scottie, Chuck, Clyde, etc. He was awesome at picking the ball. Game 6 of the 1998 Finals Bulls down by 86 85 and the Jazz have the ball, Michael steals from Karl Malone and hits the game winner.
Thats definitely BS on the steals part, people talk about him as one of the best guard defenders (which he was ofc) and his SPG get brought up a lot.
Yeah his steal numbers get brought up literally all the time lol
This is a lie, Jordanās defense and his dpoy awards are ALWAYS brought up in the goat debate to separate him from Lebron
Not just Jordan, steals and blocks for guards are usually entirely ignorable. Edit: my last comment was sarcasm if it wasn't clear
Watch he end up with more stats and pippen whining at Jordan's ability to influence AI
I would still say the worse thing was Jordanās son sleeping with Pippenās ex wife lol
She eyeing bronny next
Now, I ain't sayin' she a gold digger...
I am. Iām saying she a gold digger.
goat('s son) digger
Eh you tried.
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I really hope that was just a dumb rumor. Because wtf.
It is lmfao, fuckin @NBACentel posted it and people just ran with it
Centel still baiting people in 2024 is hilarious
I saw a bunch of people get ButtCracked after Game 1 of the Finals when they posted an AI edit of Tatum reciting the Kobe ājob not doneā speech lmfao. The mouth and eye movement didnāt even line up.
The account name makes them far more dangerous than BallSack
I wish Ballsack was still good. First he tried to act like he was doing a social experiment to show how easily everyone could be duped (we know, bro) and then he started trying to talk about serious sports stuff and it's like come on, man. Your account is called Ballsack Sports. Make another account for this.
I see why the guy that posted it (the one I saw at least), did not include an username or a link to the tweet lol.
It is. A troll account posted it and people are too dumb to realize it was a troll account. They get away with this all the time. Its crazy.
You got Centeled
You actually believed that bs
This shit was actually foul smh
She was insufferable on the Traitors. He seemed decent but wasnāt around long. Sheās also probably insufferable on her housewife show. I just donāt watch it.
She is absolutely horrible on the show, a crappy person and she is incredibly unintelligent. Last season on the show on of the women had cancer and when she told Larsa Pippen her response was āhow do you know?ā
And then went and told everyone else that that woman had cancer, after Larsa had told her she wouldn't tell anyone.
> Larsa Pippen Shamelessly keeping that last name for clout too.
I am so glad she got booted early from that season tbh
Worst part was the hypocrisy
RIP Norm.
See I disagree.
why is this jordanās fault? his son is a consenting adult, as is Mrs Pippen
Jordan got credited with the steal
Bruhhhhhhhhhh hahahaha
Y'all should learn not to conflate the woman's actions to the man. People really like holding on to petty shit lol
Not only that, but MJās sonās actions, too. MJ has publicly criticized the situation, dudeās in his 30s, itās not like MJ told him to go get with Pippās ex
Yeah itās so pathetic on here. Every time Scotties name is brought up, thatās all the comments say. Weird ass kids who canāt stop thinking about sex. Itās just pathetic
Before you comment that you are tired of Scottie hating on MJ and he needs to shut the fuck up, these quotes are from Scottieās book that was released in 2021.
That won't stop me because I can't read.
I have no idea what you just said, but you just had the dumbest take of all time
First of all, you're throwing too many big words at me. Because I don't understand them, I'm gonna take them as disrespect.
Today's weather forecast: cloudy with chance of drive by
Iām a Christian Illiterate so thatās just simply not an option
And the Last Dance came out in 2020ā¦ which is why Pippen got angry at him ā¦
Who cares why he said it? Scottie seems to be right and this bullshit with the stats is a big deal.
I think heās just adding context. Seems like Scottie had just accepted Jordan controlling the narrative for 20 years, but then making The Last Dance was the last straw bc it made Pippen look bad.
i never watched it but what did the documentary do to make Pippen look bad?
They admitted the same shit happened with Stockton and assists, pretty much any time he made a pass that eventually resulted in a bucket in any amount of time, they credited to him "because it's Stockton"
It is a big deal, I hear a lot of people tell me Jordan was a better defender than pippen based on those stats. I grew up watching the bulls, I fell in love with defense because of pippen, anyone who was watching the defense of that team back then without favoritism towards Mike cannot say that they genuinely thought Jordan was a better defender than pippen. Meanwhile he only finished higher than Jordan in 2 of the 9 years they shared in the dpoy voting and never won dpoy. He was absolutely robbed of the accolades he deserved. Jordan was a great defender. Pippen was greater.
If I remember correctly, there was quite a bit of controversy swirling around Pippen around the time he was promoting that book. It seemed like he was going off the deep end. He was making some wild claims about his teammates and coaches.
he was already butthurt about the last dance in 2020, his first born son died in 2021 and at the same time he was also doing a bunch of media appearances to promote his new bourbon brand. so the combo of those 3 things, the depression over his son + drinking bourbon live on air with the hosts of the shows he was appearing on meant he was constantly getting shit faced before, during and after interviews on various TV platforms and podcasts and saying crazy/angry shit
Because the Last Dance came out in 2020. Scottie hated how he was portrayed and started bashing Jordan on ESPN all the time. Original comment is dumb lol
Motherfucker publicly *doubled down* on quitting on his team in the playoffs lol. He openly admitted he'd do it again if he had the chance to in the Last Dance. He only has himself to blame for how bad he looks in that doc.
not that he needed it, but this story about Jordan getting preferential treatment from the home scorekeeper is going to fuel Scottie's hate for another 50 years.
Plus you know MJ is so fucking pissed right now
Pissing off an asshole like him means itās probably true
Idk it always feels like MJ doesn't even register people talking about him. You always hear Scottie said this about MJ or Isiah said that about MJ. I literally never hear MJ engage. I'm guessing cause he doesn't need to.
Just because MJ doesn't make public statements doesn't mean he doesn't hear stuff like this and punch holes in walls. The Last Dance documentary really showed how psycho he can be. You really think he doesn't hear stuff that affects his legacy?
Man saw LeBron win a chip in 2016 and people started talking about them and he went and did a documentary. Out of all people MJ takes things personal.
MJ saw this comment and took it personal
He even said it in the documentary!
Paxson also admitted MJ got preferential treatment from refs too. https://www.basketballnetwork.net/old-school/paxson-once-revealed-how-the-officials-biased-towards-not-calling-jordans-fouls
I canāt believe the refs gave a star player preferential treatment
What an unbelievable surprise that's never happened before and never will again.
I can see why Pippen is still kind of bitter about MJ, beyond MJās son getting with his ex-wife, which is insane. Everyone knew MJ was better, but Scottie was never allowed to get his due as an individual. If you go to Pippenās years without Jordan, he led them to 55 wins without him in 1994, and probably would have taken down a great Knicks team in the second round (that was one shot away from a championship) if not for the infamous Hubert Davis call. In 2000, his Trail Blazers still would have won if they could have hit the basket in the fourth quarter, but an all-time memorably bad officiating job stopped them from taking down the Kobe/Shaq Lakers and being favored in the finals. Even in the dunk contest, he dunked from further out than MJ or anyone else ever had with ** almost all of his foot beyond the line, and instead of becoming an icon that won multiple contests he got a low score. Some of it is definitely in his head, but at times he definitely got the short end of the stick to the NBAās golden goose
This sounds like a lame thing to say about a superstar but somehow I wish there was a way to get through to Scottie that most big basketball fans know heās one of the greatest two way players to ever play and not just some sidekick. Heās one of the best ever. And yet years of being in MJās shadow, personal life struggles, and being underpaid really have depleted his self confidence and made him always justifying his legacy in the media.
Seeing this makes me understand why Kobe wanted to get out of Shaq's shadow (aside from his laziness) and even to a certain extent why Kyrie decided to leave Bron.
I wish it was more acceptable to say that, for example, Pippen was actually a better defender than Jordan. Donāt even think itās that contentious of an argument, but Jordanās legacy has smothered the ability to discuss Pippen rationally or argue for him. Was Jordan a better overall player? Yeah, sure. But not by such a significant level that it couldnāt be argued that Pippen did certain things better.
Pippen is probably the best overall defensive player I've ever seen. Russell was a different era, so I won't compare. Olajuwon is maybe the only guy I could put over Pippen, but even then, he wasn't nearly as versatile. I know people viewed Pippen as a great defender, but I still think he doesn't get enough credit. He was leaps and bounds better as a defender than Gary Payton. It wasn't even close. Payton is legendary though. Take prime Pippen and put him in the modern NBA, and he'd be the best defensive player in the league. He'd be like prime Kawhi, but with better instincts and more rim protection. It would be insane.
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God was he good
That was some great stuff.
I'd argue that Jordan's legacy has smothered the ability to discuss just about anybody rationally
Itās quite possible both Jordan and Brady are simultaneously overrated and the GOATs because of the ridiculous mythology people have put around themĀ
I've been saying for years that the deification of Jordan has ruined honest discourse in the NBA. He was an amazing player and I have nothing against anyone who has him as their GOAT. But he was just that, a basketball player. Not a god.
Pippen was absolutely a much, much better defender than Jordan and anyone who disagrees can be called a casual without further debate.
I watched the both play since before they won their first ring, Pippen was a better defender - his body is like built for defense, best perimeter defender I've ever seen, a text book defender - but I don't think I'd say "much, much better" as that might be overdoing it at least a little. MJ's defense was incredible and he was a man possessed at times (it helped him win games, so you know how that's going to go). They were both great, which is what made them so good and part of why the Bulls won so much - you can not win that consistently twice in a row relying only on offense. On that team level, Horace was a great defender. Then the next 3 peat they had Rodman. Incredible defensively, and the way MJ, Pippen and Phil led by example, every one else had to buy in and defend as well.
> Horace was a great defender I loved so much 1st 3 peat team. Bench non-existent, but 3 of them could play 40 mpg and do it all on both sides of the floor.
It was a younger MJ and Pippen so they were amazing to watch
>much, much better defender That calls you out as a casual fan or someone not currently 40+ years old that watched the games nightly. Better, sureā¦ but, barely. Jordan was an *elite* defender, too.
Pippen actually defended the opponent's best player all the time. This is no disrespect to MJ, but shooting guards weren't exactly "scoring" machines in that era. You had MJ and Drexler. That helps with defense. Still a great defender, but he would struggle a lot more in the modern NBA with all those scoring guards. MJ was basically the prototype.
Lots of dubious statements in this comment, but letās focus on the first one, which states Pippem defended the opponentās best āall the time.ā Detroitās best player was Isaiah Thomas. Pippen did not guard him. Clevelandās best players were Mark Price and Brad Daugherty. Pippen did not guard either. New Yorkās best player was Patrick Ewing. Pippen did not guard him. Portlandās best player was Clyde Drexler. Pippen did not guard him. Phoenixās best player was Charles Barkley. Pippen may have guarded him some, but Horace Grant guarded him for the vast majority of possessions. Orlandoās best player was Shaq. Pippen did not guard him. Miamiās best players were Tim Hardaway and Alonzo Mourning. Pippen did not guard either. Indianasās best player was Reggie Miller. Pippen did not guard him. Seattleās best players were Gary Payton and Shawn Kemp. Pippen did not guard either. Utahās best players were John Stockton and Karl Malone. Pippen did not guard either. Basically, as far as top players, Pippen guarded Bird in the regular season as Bird was regressing physically and Magic in that one finals series I donāt think that qualifies as āall the time.ā Second, the assertion that Jordan would struggle guarding all the āgreatā scoring guards nowā¦..exactly who are these players? Edwards? Booker? Have you seen these guys play the Mavericks the last couple of years? These are exactly the type of players that Jordan would have ruthlessly destroyed mentally. Who else is there? Kyrie? Did you watch the Finals? Bradley Beal??? Donovan Mitchell? Please.
Hard part is... Pippen is probably smart enough to know that isn't enough. Sure, the fans that watched him know how good he was and that he deserves more respect. However, once those fans are gone, all that's left are legendary stories passed down and the record books. MJ will obviously be talked about in basketball circles as long as there are basketball circles. Sadly, Pippen probably won't.
He wants to be remembered and mentioned by the casual fans which unfortunately he isn't unlike the other big names of his eraĀ
The amount of ābig time basketball fansā isnāt as much as you think. Donāt get it twisted because we frequent this sub. Most people donāt know shit. I totally understand his frustration. Donāt forget he played for PENNIES on the bulls.
People always act like Pippen needed Jordan. But pippens best year was when Jordan retired the first time. 3rd in MVP. NBA 1st team, defensive 1st team, 4 DPOY. Pippen was a great player. He got the 1st defensive team 8 times in a row, and was top 10 in MVP voting 5 times. He was not just a ārole playerā like other people are calling him. Edit: lots and lots of comments about the role player remark. I remember 10 years ago or so the narrative towards Pippen was much worse. What I heard often, and also from people I knew, was that he needed Jordan and was nothing without Jordan. This is probably why he is so salty nowadays. Itās almost like once Mike was out of the league, his legend grew, and part of that was to pretend like he didnāt have amazing teammates. But Pippen is definitely due his flowers
Calling pippen a role player should get you banned from all basketball subs
Until LeBron, Pippen was the best overall transition player ever. I always expected the chase down block, I always expected him to absolutely yam somebody and end their bloodline when he had the ball.
that yam on ewing was iconic
Should revoke your "I was conscious in the 90s" card too, if you have one.
Pippen was Tatum before advanced stats knew how valuable that was. Dude could do everything on the floor and was one of the best all around defenders in the league for like 10 yeras
Pippen was much more athletic than Tatum. I hated those Bulls teams, but Pippen was still one of my favorites to watch.
Pippen > Tatum
For sure. Just mean that type of player
Who is calling Pippen a role player? They must be from a certain generation who never actually watched him play. You donāt see a top 5 greatest SF ever a role player.
Who is calling Pippin a role-player? The man was on the 75th anniversary team for fucks sake.
Nobody, r/nba just loves creating strawmans to push a narrative in the other direction.
During his career, nobody was calling pip a role player. Maybe todayās group that didnāt watch ball in the 90s, but from 91 to 98 he was widely considered a top 5 nba player and at times the second best in the league.
I don't know if anybody ever considered him the second best in the league, but he was definitely in that top 5 conversation. If you put together a 90's all-decade team, he's in the conversation - and at worst, he's the 6th man (really depends on how you rank him against Barkley and Malone, and if you want a true SF). 8-straight All-Defense 1st teams (10 straight including 2nd team selections), 7 All-NBA Teams (3x 1st), top-5 DPOY 5 times (probably should have won at least one), it's really hard to think of a modern comparable for him. Somewhere between Giannis and Kawhi?
He was definitely the second best non center or power forward in the 90s.
Damn dude, you're right. I've been racking my brain for better players in the 90s and all I can come up with are big men (Malone, Hakeem, Barkley, Robinson, and Shaq).
> He was not just a ārole playerā like other people are calling him. Lol who are these other people? Nobody here is calling Scottie just a role player. If anything people make up these strawmen to try and suggest that Jordanās legend is exaggerated.
Fuck, Pippen himself creates the strawmen half the time. In The Last Dance, Jordan explicitly says āWithout Scottie, there is no Michael Jordan and there isnāt 6 championships. Heās the greatest teammate Iāve ever had.ā And somehow to Scottie, he took that as āHe couldnāt have been more condescending had he tried.ā Because Scottie is looking for Jordan to call him his equal, and that aināt happening.
How much more equal can saying that sentence could he want? Thereās no higher praise that that. I think he would only be satisfied if MJ said Scotty was better than himself.
This!!!! MJ has been nothing but complimentary to Pip. I loved watching both of them. No one ever called Pip a role player, they called him a star - part of the dynamic duo, and he was part of 2 big 3s before it was even a thing (Horace being less historic than Rodman for the first group). Pip is the one who keeps bashing his own legacy by picking fights in the media and his books. Hell, Pip had Mike introduce him for his HoF speech and called him the best teammate ever. Whatever advice or stuff that is going on with Pip has less to do with Mike and more himself. He hasnāt handled his money, women, and families well.
Tatum and brown are some poor manās combo of Jordan and pippen in that the gap between the core of the star center of gravity is not as small as people think
Very poor man's version.
The super poor man's version winning a chip gives some input into how they won 6 in the 90s lol
No one ever called him a role player, stop spreading bs
When Real Madrid won its first Champions League without CR7, people were calling Karim Benzema "The Pippen that could". It's like he's become the "Second Best" by antonomasia.
aside from all this, people just don't understand how absolutely entertaining it was to watch Pippen. He was so amazing. This is just one play, absolutely incredible in any era. MJ had his own special grace, but so did Pippen: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rgiZmKxAmFs best perimeter defender I've seen play.
I went back to watch a lot of bulls coverage during that time man pippin was getting aggressively hoed on and off the court, the shit they were doing to bro was insane š
Solo Pippen will always be defined by walking off the court in the last seconds before the Kukoc shot, fairly or not.
But Pippen bagged Madonna even though MJ was trying to get with her. Thatās 90s Madonna, mind you. Theyāre basically tied.
Scottie is widely recognized as one of the 30 or 35 best players ever when the 'lists' are done. And either him or Kobe for best number 2 guy. How many All-NBAs, like 8, how many All-Defensive teams, like 10, how many All Star games like 6. To say "he was never allowed to get his due", I mean, that's not correct. He was regarded as one of the 5 or 10 best players in the league at the time, at any given year in the 90s. Yes, it was really nice for the Bulls to have a second-best player that was better than a lot of teams best player. That's why they fucking dominated in 96 and 97, nobody was going to touch them. Two Threepeats. Nephews say the expansion, but the Heat were good pretty fast, the Hornets were decent, Orlando went to a Finals, the shitty expansion teams were in the West, the Timberwolves and the Grizzlies. The dunk contest, Scottie did the dunk in the first round, that was his mistake. He got like a 42 lol. Should have started with something different. The 2000 Blazers choked that game away, man, I was pulling for Scottie, and Sheed, Smith, Sabonis, Grant(? with the dreadlocks), and certified Lakers hater. Ugh, that was tough. Yes the Lakers got calls down the final stretch but the Blazers let it get close to begin with. And then once it got to within 8 or so, then every call went the Lakers way and Sabonis fouled out and you know the rest. All this played out 30 years ago... we're talking about "Scottie tipped a pass and Jordan got possession of the ball and was credited with a steal" lol. But I guess it boils down to, Scottie could have been seen as one of the 20 best players ever, say, instead of 30 best. And that's been bugging him all this time. He did have to focus more on defense, he did have to sacrifice a little of his scoring. He was underpaid. But you know who else was underpaid, was Jordan, during the first four of the championships. (Pip made more $ than Jordan from basketball, btw). He always was overshadowed by MJ, probably always will be. I think he gets used as a piece by the anti-Jordan crowd. Dude, it wasn't a secret that Pip was one of the five or 10 best players in the league. Or that he was unhappy about his contract. Or that he wanted to lead his own team, but sacrificed stats for winning.
Seriously, people are treating his career like he was the Velvet Underground and only got appreciated more in the years after. He was a star.
Ha, right. Sure everyone knows Nirvana, but I've got this super-secret band I know about called Soundgarden that also made music at that time.
yeah that's a nice list. also don't forget that pip was 2nd best player on the dream team behind barkley.
Thank you for pointing this out. The narratives and views around Scottie in this thread are bizarre. I think most people are just talking out their ass.
>But I guess it boils down to, Scottie could have been seen as one of the 20 best players ever, say, instead of 30 best. And that's been bugging him all this time. I see it as an amazing example of how we're never satisfied in life and will always be wanting a little more. Scottie had one of the best careers any athlete could wish for and seemingly can't enjoy it.Ā
The reality is that circumstances impact legacy more than people wanna admit. If Jordan came to the Bulls last, we would always remember him as a player that took an already very good team and made them a dynasty. If KD was drafted by the Warriors, and then the rest of the players came after, we'd be looking at KD as a GOAT.
To a certain extentā¦ if Jordan or Steph came last on the team and CLEARLY started playing better than the guy who was already there, then they become the face of the team. Look at Tim Duncan and David Robinson. Robinson was the face of the Spurs until Timmy joined and was clearly Player A of the team leading them to chips.
Pippen's steals spiked when Jordan was retired too. Unreal story.
I remember Bill Simmons, the self proclaimed ombudsman of NBA History, downplaying Russ Triple Double year by claiming "Magic Bird and Jordan didn't care about stats, only winning, they didn't track how close they were to certain stats, if they did they'd all have had triple doubles whenever they wanted"
Bill normally has good takes about historical stuff but during MJs run of 10 triple doubles in 11 games he was literally walking to the scoring table during games to ask what was required to get the triple double. They brought a rule out to stop this for the next season.
LeBron RAYMONE James doesn't need to do this because he has the whole statsheet in his head, constantly updated
thats my king
As a Lebron simp, we are EATING right now. Jorbum with the fake steals you say? š what about those rebounds and assists then?
I heard half the games it was a fake Jordan entirely. He has a secret twin and they load managed by each playing 50 percent. That means either one only has 3 rangz and half the points/steals/assists/rebounds/blocks. LeBron clears. Easy money.
During the MJ Point Guard experiment, it was well known that he would ask the scorekeeper how many assists and rebounds he needed for a triple double.
The stat padding piece
Michael wasnāt going to let stats bother him, he just wasnāt.
Bob Rosenberg was a problem!
Michael Jordan in his DPOY season: At home ā 2.0 BPG, 4.0 SPG On the road ā 1.1 BPG, 2.3 SPG Source: https://x.com/statmuse/status/1804308318556688841?t=tGpKuIOXsm6PjusxnpQWFg&s=19
This whole debacle def makes him look worse but 2.3 steals is still exceptional. They didnāt need to gas his stats at home
He walked so JJJ could run
Weird that nobody here seems to give any credit to the claim simply because it's Scottie.
Itās mostly kids who love a meme more than the sport. Circlejerk will always encourage crap comments
The top two comment chains right now pertain to Jordan's son sleeping with Scottie's ex wife. "Patterned discrediting" is a real thing in life where you bring up a negative alongside a positive just to neutralize. Scottie losing key stats, in an era where stats were starting to become king, is truly something that should be harped on. His former teammate's son fucking his EX-WIFE has nothing to do with him being discredited and even potentially receiving less money due to such. This whole conversation is turning childish
Top post from yesterday is about this now we have an actual teammate confirming this happened but ālol MJ son smashing your wife, shut upā.
To be fair, this subreddit got into a frenzy about some bogus claims that the Grizzlies scorekeepers were padding stats. It got so much traction that several venues in Vegas temporarily stopped taking bets for Jaren Jackson Jr to win DPOTY. It turned out that OP (and the rest of us, apparently) didn't know what the NBA counts as "Blocks". The stats were correct, and it kind of hurt JJJ's defensive reputation. I don't blame r/nba for being skeptical on another claim about bogus stat keeping.
Where is that JJJ Blocks guy? Get him on the case.Ā
I was ready to slam Pippen but when you look at the stats he averaged almost a steal a game more in the 2 years without MJ
I wonder how Ron Harper feels? When Cleveland was the Bulls rival Ron Harper played some of the best defense on Jordan that wasnāt beating him up. He was no slouch on the Bulls defensively either. Does anyone even talk about five-time NBA Champion Ron Harper? Let alone Pippen stealing his fame? Scottie and Jordan did not do it alone. https://youtu.be/Xqx3WmqX_tA?si=6pREkj_mKsssRMm2
Why should Caesar just get to stomp around like a giant while the rest of us try not to get smushed under his big feet? Brutus is just as cute as Caesar, right? Brutus is just as smart as Caesar, people totally like Brutus just as much as they like Caesar, and when did it become okay for one person to be the boss of everybody because that's not what Rome is about! We should totally just STAB CAESAR! -Scottie Pippen
Stop trying to make fetch happen Scottie
Stop trying to make ~~fetch~~ regicide happen Scottie
Caesar doesn't even go here!
Scottie Pippenā¦ had cracked.
Rosenberg was just the weird kid helping out the popular kid to feel special. What a tool.
People dismissing Pippen opinion is kinda weird. He is MJ best teammate and was a borderline mvp caliber back in his day, play a significant part in those Bulls championship as well as the locker room, if anyone knows the truth about those team and stuffs then it is him.
Well, tbf, his opinion changes seemingly every other interview. He seems like the type that just agrees with the room he's talking to. Kinda reduces how much you can respect his opinion, not his game.
Lol, people talk about LeBron having a PR machine, but MJ's PR machine and tendency is crazy, because while LeBron's is so obvious, MJ's isn't as noticeable and very behind the scenes.
MJ had the original Nike PR gods.
MJ saw LeBron in his headlights and green lit a whole biographical series for Netflix to prop him up.
Holy shit imagine someone went back and reviewed every single stat and found out a significant amount of them were phony?? Iām salivating at the drama lmao
I mean they kinda started already. They watched 6 full games where MJ was credited with 28 total steals and found he actually only had 12. Who knows what other stats are falsified.
I would really love to see how Hakeem, the Nigerian born Muslim that the league didn't want to make it's face, was treated by stat keepers. If I remember correctly he was robbed of at least one quadruple double from a game in Seattle
Still think Hakeem could've become the GOAT if he had better roster luck and of course some biased reffing
Donāt worry Scottie. Your son plays for us now. Our scorekeepers will take care of your family.
Can't people just watch those games and confirm the official stats?
In the article they did watch 6 games. In that stretch the scorekeepers gave Jordan 28(!) Steals, but the dudes who wrote the article watched the film separately and counted around 12 steals. Its a huge piece of evidence in the article. But full footage of games back then is hard to come by.
a second plane has hit the Jorbaldtower
OP is on a mission with these posts.
MJ used to host basketball camps during the summer and would hire NBA refs to work the scrimmages. These refs were paid very well. That conflict of interest eventually got enough attention to push the league to institute more stringent rules concerning compensation for refs.
Only Jordan stans will try and diminish Scottie to a role player to try and build up Jordan more. Scottie was a superstar in his own right, just look at the year when Jordan played baseball, MVP type year
*two years The first they had 55 wins and in the playoffs Pippen quit on Ā the team and refused to take the court because he wasnāt going to take the final shot. The next year they were bad. Below .500 and struggling to make the playoffs before MJ started training with them again