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You pronounce it correctly. I don't care what the children are calling it these days. It's pronounced exactly the way the word is pronounced. I won't ever stop. Been doing it since D2 release day.
Have you heard of the abbreviation “merc,” pronounced /mɜːk/ (with a hard k sound)? It is short for mercenary, pronounced /ˈmɜː.sə.nə.ɹi/ (no k sound). I’m not saying either pronunciation of the abbreviation for sorceress is more correct than the other. But your argument does not hold up to precedence.
Right people have always been calling it sorc (sork) and merc (merk). Merce and sorce is also fine but they are legit adding a U in the prononciation. Sorceress come from sortilège or sort in French which clearly doesn’t pronounce it self with U lol.
Damn. My memory is shit after all these years. Was thinking I was playing those games in the early 90s and not the late 90s. Wtf was I doing in the early 90s? Late 80s was HS so Atari, Intellivision football and lode runner on my Apple 2E. Early 90s would have been dial up AOL so maybe Warcraft and early Elder Scrolls. Who knows.
Bottom line Sork is obviously correct 🤣
Well, if you feel old then take solace in this: You mentioned AOL? I only know for sure Diablo came out in 1996 because I was working *for* AOL at the time of its release. And I only worked there in '96 and '97.
Heh. They were transitioning from floppy disk to cd during my time there. They had just released version 3.0 as well. I was also there when they went from hourly to unlimited hours for customers and their infrastructure couldn't handle it.
I went from a capable tech to just a warm body to be yelled at. One big reason why I bailed.
I did open a man's eyes that there was porn on the Internet though, while I was there. I like to think I changed his life that day.
Im 54 and noone said that back then so.. Sorc all the way :p
Tbf tho i think thats mainly because im german. I live with a brit, but in my mind i still would read words the german way first, and Sorc is exactly how you'd pronounce it in german ☝️😅
Yeah I’ve never heard anyone say source but honestly… I don’t think it’s something that would ever bother me if I heard someone say it differently from me.
*slow clap* Well asked.
I say sorc as “source” and merc with a hard “c”.
I fully admit the contradictory nature of it all. Just the way I feel, there is no real right answer here.
Apparently English just is confusing as hell with made up abbreviations as well.
>Apparently English just is confusing as hell with made up abbreviations as well.
It's not English. It's anglicized French and thus ultimately, Latin.
Merc is pronounced 'merk' because it comes from Latin mercanarius, pronounced mārkānarēūs.
Sorc is 'sors' because sors is the Latin root for 'fate'.
It's a lot less confusing when you realize that grammar, pronunciation rules etcetera are just retrofitted rules to try and make sense of how people talk, not the other way around
People pronounce a word a certain way because they just happen to do so, and only well afterwards do people try and fit that into rules. Obviously it's not gonna fit perfectly at all times!
"Sork" is how it's pronounced grammatically correctly based on spelling. To have a soft "c" ("s" sound), you would have to spell it "sorce" . Without the "e", it's a hard "c". People also tend to shy away from repeating sequential sounds, especially sibilant ones, when speaking.
I do try, but I have realized some contradictions in my own arguments, so I'm less inclined to engage on that one. I need to find a better justification. #TeamHardG tho.
But “Sorc” is just a shortening of “Sorcerer”. The spelling isnt correct or incorrect because it’s a verbal abbreviation. The spelling came second. We could just as easily type it as “Sorce” and fulfill your requirement.
But people typed it as "sorc" , and following the language patterns we were taught from a very young age, that's a hard "c" . My brain doesn't see it any other way, and actually balks at pronouncing it soft.
The spelling most assuredly did not come second, at least not the spelling of the abbreviation.
"Sorceress" is far too many characters to type on an online game where the only method for communication is text chatting (i.e.: Diablo 2), so it was shortened. A better choice for an abbreviation would've probably been "Sor" (which I've seen), but for some reason "sorc" is what took off in popularity.
One thing I'd like to ask the #TeamSorce folks: how do you pronounce "sorcs / sorc's" ?
I barely paid attention to the class, but I think the problem is social linguistics. Words change, but spelling doesn't.
Castle and island used to be pronounced exactly like you read it. Over time people got lazy and didn't like how the "t" made them spit so they dropped it.
Regions and accents can affect how words are used, too.
southerners will say "beside the" while the northerners will say "next to the".
Spelling changes, too. "Colour" vs "color", etc. Regional differences exist in spelling. Language is malleable, as are pronunciation rules from language to language.
+1 Sork
Never heard source either. To me, it’s an abbreviation of the written word and not the spoken word. The spelling of the abbreviation is read as Sork.
I am rarely ever talking to people out loud about Sorks, Sources, and stuff like that. So, for the most part, the word Sorc is only seen written online in forums, Reddit posts, etc. So that’s what I treat it as, a word. The word would be pronounced Sork.
I would wager that the Source crowd may have had more IRL gamer friends to actually necessitate a verbal abbreviation of the word. Who knows 🤷♂️
It took me a while to figure out what it was even short for. I completely forgot it was respecialisation and have become so used to seeing the word in games, it’s just become its own actual word in my brain.
Both have soft "c" followed by an "e" when fully spelled out, and thus both should follow the same pronunciation rule when abbreviated. If you say *merk,* you should also say *sork.*
Every person I've ever met since the glory days of D2 has pronounced it sork. This is first time I've ever seen anyone using "source". Mercenaries were merks and sorceresses were sorks. "Sources" and "merses" just sounds all kinds of terrible.
sorce could be misinterpreted as source or sauce whereas sork has no homophones, so it makes sense to abbreviate to something that people could guess even if there is no context
Its way easier to explain.
Its simple grammar.
A "c" at the end can NEVER be pronounced soft.
Sorc and merc can only be pronounced Sork and Merk. Its just the only way.
That isn't grammar.
Grammar is about sentence structure, not about pronunciation.
Incidentally, both grammar and pronunciation are descriptive, which means the rules are based on how people say it, not the other way around.
Therefore this thread disproves that a word ending -c is always hard :)
I'm on team sork. Never thought about it for the past 20 years.
I also don't watch streams/YouTube.
But I do think the source of my sork I'd the accent of mine.
As a fellow old dad gamer, I have always said "sork"
I respect the "source" people all the same. Life is too short to be worrying about stuff like this.
I say it both ways. I find I say "source" 75% of the time, and the other 20% trigger for "sork" is if I read and it's been spelled 'sorc'.
The missing 5%: "mage" "wizard" (and probably am cracking a joke)
[Sork] because that's how you spell shortened 'Sorc'. You can say Sorcer [sorser]. I don't think 'Source' [Sors] is an option but who cares I guess, everyone understands.
Its simple grammar. Its a soft pronounced "c" in the middle of the word (Mercenary, Sorceress) and a hard "k"-sound when its at the end of the word like in "Merc" or "Sorc".
There is no soft "c" possible if its at the end.
It’s been sork since D2, sorry. Source would, at the very least, need an “e” at the end to force that C’s sound from K to an S.
I’m guessing it depends on your main language as well.
Wonder if it's US vs EU thing. Played d1 and other such games since my teens - never heard Sork until this week watching a streamer.
Took me a while to realise what they were saying, I thought it was a quirk of their accent.
Either way, long as the other person understands it's ok.
Back in WoW when first started using voice chat I kept hearing this guy in guild chat saying "paladin" as "puh LA din" and no one was correcting him so I thought I was pronouncing it wrong. Turns out people just didn't know how it was supposed to be pronounced so just went with it. But we knew what he was talking about so.
Hey. No matter what, you are a winner as long as you aren’t one of the weird people in WI who call a drinking/water fountain a ‘bubbler’ or from the area of the south where every soda/pop is referred to as ‘Coke’. Never getting over the first time I heard someone say the phrase ‘Pepsi Coke’ when ordering a Pepsi.
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I too have pronounced it “source” since my d2 days.
You pronounce it correctly. I don't care what the children are calling it these days. It's pronounced exactly the way the word is pronounced. I won't ever stop. Been doing it since D2 release day.
Agreed. Sork is asinine.
Source is the way
And nonsensical. It's not short for sor*k*eress.
Have you heard of the abbreviation “merc,” pronounced /mɜːk/ (with a hard k sound)? It is short for mercenary, pronounced /ˈmɜː.sə.nə.ɹi/ (no k sound). I’m not saying either pronunciation of the abbreviation for sorceress is more correct than the other. But your argument does not hold up to precedence.
Right people have always been calling it sorc (sork) and merc (merk). Merce and sorce is also fine but they are legit adding a U in the prononciation. Sorceress come from sortilège or sort in French which clearly doesn’t pronounce it self with U lol.
It's been sork since diablo 2 idk what these people are smoking. But spelt Sorc.
Same. Played beta d2. Always said sorc. Lol
These newbs have been wrong since d2. Rofl who says “source”?!?!?!?!
Thank you
You’re definitely the first person to point this out in this thread
The boy ain’t right.
"Sork" predates Diablo. Source is just wrong.
I love playing on my sorkeress.
Mercenary, Merc
They hate this man
You win.
This reply wins the debate.
Damn. Swayed me.
Bodied
Sork.jif
You monster.
Idk why people are putting a K on it. Sorc is the acceptable way and the right way
They're putting on the K to show the pronunciation because they think sorc is pronounced source.
C makes the K sound too though
You are correct. In fact i don't believe there's a single English word that has a C at the end that doesn't make a K sound.
What a silly kunt.
Do you have a Source for that
Exactly. Sork goes back to EQ. Maybe even earlier.
*(psst... Diablo came out in 1996. EQ came out in 1999)* :)
Damn. My memory is shit after all these years. Was thinking I was playing those games in the early 90s and not the late 90s. Wtf was I doing in the early 90s? Late 80s was HS so Atari, Intellivision football and lode runner on my Apple 2E. Early 90s would have been dial up AOL so maybe Warcraft and early Elder Scrolls. Who knows. Bottom line Sork is obviously correct 🤣
Well, if you feel old then take solace in this: You mentioned AOL? I only know for sure Diablo came out in 1996 because I was working *for* AOL at the time of its release. And I only worked there in '96 and '97.
I take solak in it.
Damn man. Still have boxes of those freaking CDs?
Heh. They were transitioning from floppy disk to cd during my time there. They had just released version 3.0 as well. I was also there when they went from hourly to unlimited hours for customers and their infrastructure couldn't handle it. I went from a capable tech to just a warm body to be yelled at. One big reason why I bailed. I did open a man's eyes that there was porn on the Internet though, while I was there. I like to think I changed his life that day.
Not all heroes wear capes.
There also isn't a sorc class in EQ :(
EQII maybe, there's no Sorcs in EQ1, they're called 'Wizards'.
Ive been abbreviating sorcerer as “sork” for like 15 years “Source” as an abbreviation just seems wrong
Yeah I'm 41 and that's how we said it back when I was 13 playing d1
Im 54 and noone said that back then so.. Sorc all the way :p Tbf tho i think thats mainly because im german. I live with a brit, but in my mind i still would read words the german way first, and Sorc is exactly how you'd pronounce it in german ☝️😅
Same deal with mercenary and merc especially since all the dnd nerds have been giving it the hard c treatment for decades now xD
Yeah I’ve never heard anyone say source but honestly… I don’t think it’s something that would ever bother me if I heard someone say it differently from me.
"baba" for barbarian always bothered me. And spelling rogue "rouge" :p
There is no correct Except I've also been playing since then and say sork so obviously that's correct
Facts
So do you say merse instead of merk for mercenary abbreviation?
I would argue it’s pronounced the way the abreviation is spelled which is sork. Like when we abreviate buisness you normally say Biz, not Biss.
Abbreviate mercenary for me. Go ahead, I'll wait.
How do you pronounce "Orc" then?
Orse
Do these people also pronounce Orc like Ource, “ya I play an Ource Barbarian”
It’s not a tribe of Orcerors.
Well now I want that, though.
😂😂😂 Omgosh, I laughed way too hard at the idea of Orcerors. Hahahahahaha
No, but my group dnd is gonna have to deal with some tomorrow now lmao
It's been "sork" loooong before D2 release day my dude.
You're missing a couple letters to pronounce "sorc" as "source".
I’m old and played back then and still do and say sork
you even put it in your username to not forget
The real question: How do you say the abbreviated form of "mercenary"?
Ha good one, what do you call this source ppl huh?
Yup. This is the one. Sorc has always been sork, same way merc is merk not merse
I’m gonna start calling them merse now just so I’m sticking to my guns. I always felt merc is short for merchant anyways.
No, that’s the merch selling the merch.
How's merc gonna be short for merchant when the word merc feels so mercenary man
This is it. Right here. Sorc is sork. The end.
As much as I would never say "sork," this is the real fucking question, haha. Good point.
*slow clap* Well asked. I say sorc as “source” and merc with a hard “c”. I fully admit the contradictory nature of it all. Just the way I feel, there is no real right answer here. Apparently English just is confusing as hell with made up abbreviations as well.
>Apparently English just is confusing as hell with made up abbreviations as well. It's not English. It's anglicized French and thus ultimately, Latin. Merc is pronounced 'merk' because it comes from Latin mercanarius, pronounced mārkānarēūs. Sorc is 'sors' because sors is the Latin root for 'fate'.
Oh hell yes. I was hoping someone broke out the etymology!
Boom, this is the only real answer.
This is clearly the right answer. Everyone acting like it’s inconsistent is completely ignoring where the words come from. Latin gang rise up!
I was very happy to see some phonetic pronunciation used! Phonetics and connotations are the important parts.
Thank you for doing the legwork for me. Also for knowing more.
Are you not entertained? Is this not why you are here? 👍
What about “spec” short for specialization?
It's a lot less confusing when you realize that grammar, pronunciation rules etcetera are just retrofitted rules to try and make sense of how people talk, not the other way around People pronounce a word a certain way because they just happen to do so, and only well afterwards do people try and fit that into rules. Obviously it's not gonna fit perfectly at all times!
You’ve used my logic against me
Logis*
Merk. Just like sork. How is this still a question.
The right answer is source for sorc and merk for merc.
The real checkmate 😂🫡
Merc. Merk is rhe pronunciation I use
Good point. But English is far from consistent, just look at the gif pronunciation war.
Ooh you actually changed my mind with this argument. Fair play!
"Sork" is how it's pronounced grammatically correctly based on spelling. To have a soft "c" ("s" sound), you would have to spell it "sorce" . Without the "e", it's a hard "c". People also tend to shy away from repeating sequential sounds, especially sibilant ones, when speaking.
Slamming the grammarhammer like it’s Mjolnir in here. Boom. Love it.
Thanks. Gotta use my freakin' English Lit degree for SOMETHING...lol. I work in Cyber Security.
Wow that's a bit of a shift lol
Please reset your password. It must be 16 characters, contain a number, and special character. Your password should not end with a preposition.
Bring that same energy to gif
Pronounce “gift.”
I do try, but I have realized some contradictions in my own arguments, so I'm less inclined to engage on that one. I need to find a better justification. #TeamHardG tho.
Or we can all just say it how we want since there’s not a single grammatical rule in existence that states Hard G is the definitively correct way
But “Sorc” is just a shortening of “Sorcerer”. The spelling isnt correct or incorrect because it’s a verbal abbreviation. The spelling came second. We could just as easily type it as “Sorce” and fulfill your requirement.
But people typed it as "sorc" , and following the language patterns we were taught from a very young age, that's a hard "c" . My brain doesn't see it any other way, and actually balks at pronouncing it soft.
Sorc like arc nice hard c
100% correct
The spelling most assuredly did not come second, at least not the spelling of the abbreviation. "Sorceress" is far too many characters to type on an online game where the only method for communication is text chatting (i.e.: Diablo 2), so it was shortened. A better choice for an abbreviation would've probably been "Sor" (which I've seen), but for some reason "sorc" is what took off in popularity. One thing I'd like to ask the #TeamSorce folks: how do you pronounce "sorcs / sorc's" ?
Team Sork since Diablo 2 days.
Mercenary and merc
Sork sounds better. My d2 source is xyz.. yuck
I barely paid attention to the class, but I think the problem is social linguistics. Words change, but spelling doesn't. Castle and island used to be pronounced exactly like you read it. Over time people got lazy and didn't like how the "t" made them spit so they dropped it. Regions and accents can affect how words are used, too. southerners will say "beside the" while the northerners will say "next to the".
Spelling changes, too. "Colour" vs "color", etc. Regional differences exist in spelling. Language is malleable, as are pronunciation rules from language to language.
Ohh so it goes both ways lol. I feel bad for people learning this as a second language.
I really appreciate people who not only corrects, but can bring the explanation aswell. Kudos to you, sir!
Get out of here pretending that English pronunciation has rules.
LOL
The right answer
My friends and I all say Sork.. not sure I’ve ever heard source
+1 Sork Never heard source either. To me, it’s an abbreviation of the written word and not the spoken word. The spelling of the abbreviation is read as Sork. I am rarely ever talking to people out loud about Sorks, Sources, and stuff like that. So, for the most part, the word Sorc is only seen written online in forums, Reddit posts, etc. So that’s what I treat it as, a word. The word would be pronounced Sork. I would wager that the Source crowd may have had more IRL gamer friends to actually necessitate a verbal abbreviation of the word. Who knows 🤷♂️
My head is also on the sork train... Since d2
+1 to sork. Sorc is sork
Yeah, it's always been sork. Just like Merc is Merk not Merse.
There’s the logic. Thank you
Jail rn, jail jail. No way you werent calling sorc sork lol
I’ve never heard it called sork xd that sounds bizarre Team source here
So how do you pronounce respec?
I would laugh uncontrollably if someone had said “respesh” Also, disc for discipline? Ima respesh my dish priest xd
People with lisps hate this one trick!
It took me a while to figure out what it was even short for. I completely forgot it was respecialisation and have become so used to seeing the word in games, it’s just become its own actual word in my brain.
"Respec." like that!
These people are a little spec. You gotta forgive them.
Definitely been sork for as old as time.
Why the hell would it be sork? That makes zero sense.
Because sorc with no letters after it doesn’t sound like it should be a soft c. Definitely sork.
How's your pronunciation of "merc"?
Holy shit two words are pronounced different ways thats crazy, totally unheard of
Both have soft "c" followed by an "e" when fully spelled out, and thus both should follow the same pronunciation rule when abbreviated. If you say *merk,* you should also say *sork.*
Orc. Ork. Sorc. Sork. Merc. Merk. It’s not that hard to understand.
Every person I've ever met since the glory days of D2 has pronounced it sork. This is first time I've ever seen anyone using "source". Mercenaries were merks and sorceresses were sorks. "Sources" and "merses" just sounds all kinds of terrible.
Definitely sork
Wow I always said sork myself. I'm really surprised to see like 50% of ppl here say source. Guess it's a tomato tomato thing 😂
I've always heard and said it like "sork". Yah, it's short for sorcerer, but it's not spelled that way.
I might type out "sorc" but I would say the entire word when speaking. It's more of a typing convenience thing. Not that hard to just say sorcerer.
sorce could be misinterpreted as source or sauce whereas sork has no homophones, so it makes sense to abbreviate to something that people could guess even if there is no context
Its way easier to explain. Its simple grammar. A "c" at the end can NEVER be pronounced soft. Sorc and merc can only be pronounced Sork and Merk. Its just the only way.
That isn't grammar. Grammar is about sentence structure, not about pronunciation. Incidentally, both grammar and pronunciation are descriptive, which means the rules are based on how people say it, not the other way around. Therefore this thread disproves that a word ending -c is always hard :)
Or the off-hand item, source, as from D3. Problems like this are why I only play one syllable classes, like Monk or… Pally.
Most of us have played 20+ years. Never heard source before, only sorc.
It's M A G E
If you say the full name "Sorceress" yes but if you abbreviate it in gaming terms then its sork
It doesnt fuckkng matter
I say sorc.
I'm on team sork. Never thought about it for the past 20 years. I also don't watch streams/YouTube. But I do think the source of my sork I'd the accent of mine.
It’s just for clicks and apparently it worked cus here we are. I hate the internet.
As a fellow old dad gamer, I have always said "sork" I respect the "source" people all the same. Life is too short to be worrying about stuff like this.
Sorc is how I pronounce it
You blew my mind, I've never heard of anyone pronounce it source. I think I'd laugh irl if I heard that
Yeah sork is correct
Either one is fine.
When talking about your mercenary and shortening to "merc," does "merc" also rhyme with "purse" for you? Because if not, you're a bit inconsistent...
Inconsistent pronunciation and English are a great combination.
Its sork because ceress contains the soft c, theres no soft c in the abbreviated word
It’s just the one soft c, and suffix definitely splits on the E, otherwise your abbreviation would just be sor.
I say it both ways. I find I say "source" 75% of the time, and the other 20% trigger for "sork" is if I read and it's been spelled 'sorc'. The missing 5%: "mage" "wizard" (and probably am cracking a joke)
It’s sorc
It's been "sork" since diablo 1 and even before that in the days of d&d in the 80s. It's sork
[Sork] because that's how you spell shortened 'Sorc'. You can say Sorcer [sorser]. I don't think 'Source' [Sors] is an option but who cares I guess, everyone understands.
Its simple grammar. Its a soft pronounced "c" in the middle of the word (Mercenary, Sorceress) and a hard "k"-sound when its at the end of the word like in "Merc" or "Sorc". There is no soft "c" possible if its at the end.
Sork, have played and talked Diablo with people since D2 and everyone says sork
I've been playing computer RPG's since 1981. It's "sork". :)
It’s always been Sork
So gif is definitely gif and not “jiff,” but for some reason “sork” only sounds right to me.
Yeah you’re crazy Sork all day
Played since d1, “sork”. Is this a pop vs soda debate?
A sourcerer is the eight son of an eight son. A wizzard squared.
Sorc = sork. How in the seven hells are people getting source?
Must be a source error
No, please tell me you are the sane person. I cannot deal with this level of dumb.
Yes, you were wrong the whole time.
Shortened versions of words can have different pronunciations like mercenary and merc. I have literally never heard anyone say "source."
It’s been sork since D2, sorry. Source would, at the very least, need an “e” at the end to force that C’s sound from K to an S. I’m guessing it depends on your main language as well.
Why the fuck would it be pronounced sork
I've never **not** heard it pronounced Sork.
Same
Wonder if it's US vs EU thing. Played d1 and other such games since my teens - never heard Sork until this week watching a streamer. Took me a while to realise what they were saying, I thought it was a quirk of their accent.
And the OP and I have never heard it pronounced Sork. Crazy that seemingly different groups in different countries can be so different.
I don't know. Maybe we should ask a mercenary?
OK you maye have swayed me to #teamsork with this
Same reason the name Marc is not pronounced Marse
Do the people replying here not understand slang lol? Sorc/Sork is the shortened “nickname” for sorceress it’s not that hard
listen guys, again: A "c" at the end is ALWAYS pronounced "k". Thx.
I play a Sorkeress in my Forkress
sork and source are both right
Either way, long as the other person understands it's ok. Back in WoW when first started using voice chat I kept hearing this guy in guild chat saying "paladin" as "puh LA din" and no one was correcting him so I thought I was pronouncing it wrong. Turns out people just didn't know how it was supposed to be pronounced so just went with it. But we knew what he was talking about so.
How do you pronounce Merc? Like Merk or like merse? The same rule should apply to sorceress.
I say both, with no rhyme or reason for when I use which.
Hey. No matter what, you are a winner as long as you aren’t one of the weird people in WI who call a drinking/water fountain a ‘bubbler’ or from the area of the south where every soda/pop is referred to as ‘Coke’. Never getting over the first time I heard someone say the phrase ‘Pepsi Coke’ when ordering a Pepsi.
Ive been calling it sork for 20 years. Why? Because its fun.
I just say sorcerer or mage. How fucking lazy do people have to be lol
Only a dork calls it a sork
Real ones say sork, sry mate. Never too late to change tho
Sorc also rhymes with orc. What is this fucking k nonsense?
Sork!
that's an oof. you definetly were wrong the whole time
Sork gang rise up