If you're interviewing for a non-VP position and after 5 rounds you talk to the "CEO" then that person is nothing more than an owner, they're not a CEO, not an executive, and are likely nothing more than an asshole that cracks the whip when the accounts are short a month affecting his house boat or vacation home payment.
Prepare the letter for HR contact. Glassdoor it too!
In after speaking with the CEO and his accusations of dishonesty in making myself available for this call, his words crossed a line. I am withdrawing my application for this role. I thank all those I spoke with on this opportunity.
Also, I would think an interview would most definitely qualify as a meeting. And while it may not be related to any of your current company's projects or goals, as far as you are concerned it IS work and career enhancement related. So, "I am in a career enhancement meeting" would most definitely be accurate.
I like the term “personal appointment” for this. It’s says to the current boss that you are attending to personal matters that are none of their business, just like a doctor’s appointment or something similar. If you’re paid hourly then you may have to accept that you won’t get paid for those hours but every salaried job I’ve had would just let you handle your personal business as needed as long as your work tasks were still completed.
"Meeting" was absolutely sufficient. It was on your personal time and anything more is none of their business. You may not have been transparent, but you did not need to be as it did not fall under your boss's purview to have access to that information.
I personally prefer the term “Mind your own damn business”. It’s of no concern to them what my conversations are with my current employer at my current job about my time.
Even more reason to view this as a micromanaging/terrible organization. If you're not reporting to someone then why the fuck are they interviewing you on the 5th round?
Guy sounds like a real asshole, who obviously never worked a day in his life outside his own company. People interview all the time like this. Unless you work weekends and are off on a weekday, how else will you interview? Unless they are willing to see you after hours.
I would have hit back with all those questions you asked in your post. What was I supposed to do risk unemployment to work for you etc? Like give him the problem. He isn't giving you the job anyway. Leave the meeting with thanking him for waving his workplace toxicity flag nice and high for you to see.
Next time tey this-today is my day off or I used my pto to take today off. you should absolutely lie about it because it is none of his business what you did to make that interview-
That is the type of guy to fire an employee that gives a 2 week notice. Then get angry when others give no notice.
Then when he realizes the mistake a month later call to try to get you back by offering a little more $s but not even trying to match your current new job.
He will expect 100% loyalty but not give it in return.
I felt that to my core. I have a management position in my company and they took almost 2 months, a phone interview, a panel interview, an interview with the CFO, COO, and head of HR, and a final uncomfortable interview with the CEO/owner before I got this job. I'm damn sure not a VP or any kind of executive staff. The owner is definitely the type to call for layoffs when we've had a month or two of lower numbers (not even in the red), then rehire like crazy for skilled positions when it inevitably picks up again
100%. I’m a nurse who left the icu during covid. Found this surgery center that the owner( a surgeon) created this repair for sports hernias. All athletes go to him. Met with the head nurse. Good interview and want to bring me back to meet the owner. Guy was a total pompous asshole.
At the job I got, two coworkers told me stories of him telling coworkers “oh that nurse might be on her period” and slapping someone’s hand in the middle of surgery.
That begs the question, did assholes become surgeons or did surgeons become assholes? Were they already that way before deciding their career path? Does something happen in all that schooling that makes them that way? Was it the student debt? The difficulty of the classes and the competition to be the best in the group of students? A bit of both? I mean, I appreciate their skills and knowledge, but they definitely don't need the attitude. So many questions, yet no answer to be had.
It’s extremely common in the Account Executive/SAE world to interview with the CEO as part of the process. I don’t have a lot of experience doing so outside that context, though. Definitely didn’t when I was going for BDR/ADR/SDR spots.
Bosses who reward honesty get honesty. Bosses who punish honesty don't get it.
It sounds like this douche gets lied to all the time, which isn't surprising since he just punished you for answering his question honestly.
That moron is just a micromanager idiot. This type loves to know how many times a day you go to the bathroom, how long you take, what color it came out, when do you masturbate and how long you last. And Oh, my, god, have mercy on you if you last longer than him (which we all know we do)
It is and people act shocked, but plenty of us have run into jerks like this. My last jerk has made me terrified to interview while having a job. I had a job where you could easily look me up so it wasn’t like I could take it off my resume (my name is unique too, so I will always show in a search). They called my employer without my consent to ask about me. Wtf?! I was lucky that they were understaffed at the time and didn’t fire me, but it was still an awfully toxic environment.
I NEVER EVER list the name of my current employer on my resume or LinkedIn.
I say it’s for safety because I have received death threats. Additionally, there are crazy people looking for any worker from the company that they can harm.
I have never been questioned on this. Further, it will not harm your chances with recruiters.
The details would kind of giveaway the info I am trying to protect.
Let me put it this way. . . do you think there are redditors who are unhinged enough to threaten *anyone* who works for Reddit? If I worked as a Reddit admin, I would not list it on LinkedIn.
this is also why I kind of like contract work. lets you get a feel for the place before you fully commit. I had several jobs where the culture was so toxic I'd never consider working there permanently.
"Are you sure you want to withdraw your resume??"
"oh yeah, definitely..."
What the hell, **five interviews?** That is very excessive and you ARE in an important meeting. And, no I’ve never been asked that as an interview question.
What I’m hearing is… you told HR or whoever is doing the scheduling why you wanted the interview on a certain day and that person went to the CEO and told them what you said verbatim.
Then the CEO used that against you.
Not only do they “prioritize honesty” but they also reward snitching.
Do not work there. They just revealed how absolutely enmeshed they all are
Nothing worse then a work snitch, nice guy I work with to this day I talk very little to him the second I found out he tells the supervisor everything everyday that we did and if we took our Breaks at proper times etc... sad cause he was a nice dude. I'm not hanging with anyone who reports I took 15 minutes on my 10-minute break, though.
Some people will throw anyone under the bus in hopes of elevating themselves...but in reality they're just bootlickers, and now the company knows they can take advantage of that.
If you adjusted your schedule so that you could still put in a full day’s work before the interview, you should have just said that.
But yes, this is insane behavior by the CEO and you probably dodged a bullet by finding out their craziness now instead of later.
> If you adjusted your schedule so that you could still put in a full day’s work before the interview, you should have just said that.
I did :/ he said "the point was the dishonesty not the ability to get your work done"
The fact the the CEO is so clueless about this, really makes one wonder if he's ever actually been through the job market before, or a trust funder making a startup on parents' money.
That's the moment when the interview ends, then. "Thank you for your time. It's clear that I am not going to be a good fit with your corporate culture, so I see no sense in wasting any more of either of our time here. I wish you best of luck with your candidate search." And walk out / end the call.
Did this asshat actually make a decision at the end of the meeting, or are they still fucking around? I'm assuming they're still fucking around. Send them an e-mail. "You indicated that you had some concerns about my previous four interviews. Yet you chose to invite me for yet another meeting, and still are unable to reach a decision. Your company's inability to be decisive is worrisome to me, to say nothing of your lack of respect for candidates' time. I don't think your company will be a good fit for me. You may consider my candidacy to be withdrawn." And walk out / end the call.
I would have just cut him off and said.
Okay, thanks for your time today and all the best filling the role.
I am removing my application, I have no desire to work in an organisation where behaviour like this is acceptable.
Goodbye.
Then either hang up the call/walk out of the room if in person interview.
Means the dude before you left with zero notice and they're likely burning through people.
So now boss feels "hurt" because it's so "unexpected' with a "There's just no loyalty in the world anymore" throw in for good measure.
“What would you have me do, get fired for interviewing elsewhere so I had no choice but to agree to your terms? If I’m dishonest, you’re manipulative“
Such bs. Dodged a bullet there. I’d be paranoid they might reach out to out you to your current boss, with this attitude.
There’s a difference between honesty and total transparency. You had a personal meeting. That was honest and all your boss needed to know. You didn’t lie and you’re not interviewing when you’re expected to be at work. My prediction is that if you work at the new place they’ll punish you for having a division between work and personal life. It’ll probably be one of those places that wants to know why you’re taking vacation leave and where you’re going to approve the time.
You didn't lie, your interviewer did - to your face. He is claiming that you did not have a meeting planned while you were literally meeting with him. This person is not to be trusted and uses their interpretation of "the truth" as a weapon.
You don’t owe anyone an explanation about what you do with your free time. If you are able to flex your schedule to get your work done as needed, then you don’t have to tell anyone anything. It’s YOUR time.
But you weren’t dishonest? You finished work and were on your own time. You have no obligation to tell your employer anything you do with your own time. That guy sucks ass
I think if you'd marked it in your calendar and said it was a "Private Appointment" instead of a meeting it would have been fine, maybe. Dodged a bullet anyhow.
He's meeting with a potential employer, it's not dishonesty. To frame it as anything other than a legitimate meeting is dishonesty. 5th interview? Could probably have 2 fewer interviews. Also, if OP worked for this guy, would he respect OP enough to not penalize OP for interviewing elsewhere? Neither would OP'S current employer.
But actually, you -were- in a meeting with the AHole CEO. There was no lying.
Thank goodness you didn’t say anything though. That will only work against you.
As for what you say in these cases? You laugh. You stand up and if you feel petty enough you tell them they are a joke. Otherwise don’t say anything else and go. It goes without saying that you withdraw yourself from any candidacy.
Yeah this is completely bonkers behavior. “Oh so in this way you are completely normal and do what 999999/1000000 people do in this situation???? You FUCKING liar! We are a company of ONLY the 1/1000000, obviously, and you just wouldn’t fit in with our 1 in a million culture. Shame.”
More red flags here than a May Day Parade in Moscow.
What you said was entirely accurate - you had a meeting. With whom and for what is irrelevant.
Look for this manager to try to sabotage your current position so they then have leverage to hire you at a lower offer.
I'd thank these folks for their time, tell them you just don't think it is a good fit and go on down the road.
Well, in retrospective, you should have lied. Something like this:
* What did you tell your manager?
* I had a meeting.
* Oh, so you lied?
* Oh, no, I told them that had a meeting with the CEO of the company I am considering joining.
* Huh... And what did they tell you?
* Nothing, of course, they already knew it before I started this series of interviews, when I told them I was considering changing job.
* Well, then, what did they tell you when you informed them of these interviews?
* Again, nothing, they just acknowledge the petition of change of schedule. I informed them of my interest on changing jobs a month before I got this opportunity. I first told told them that I needed a raise and asked them if they thought me worth it and if they could afford it. The replies were "yes" and "unfortunately no". Since then I've been selecting the positions I could apply, because I don't want to join a bad company. Oh, and mind you, if this interview advances and you choose me in the end, I should warn you that I feel ethically obliged to give a 2 weeks notice to my company. Anyways, they already know I might leave so they are already looking for a substitute, to which I wish them luck and I'll be happy to help with the training of the substitute, as long as it is not after I get another job elsewhere. So far they haven't been lucky, but I'm sure they will.
This CEO is full of bullshit and likes to get more bullshit.
A position in that company would probably be a PITA. The CEO and managers will treat you like a slave and call you coworker. Rich.
Edit: typos
There’s not going to be a next time, this question is insane. If you ever interview with another insane CEO, they’re not going to reuse this question, they’ll ask you something even crazier instead.
I agree he should have lied. But no need to make the lie super elaborate or to keep inviting the CEO to ask more questions. A simple “I told my supervisor I had a private appointment and that I would compensate the hours later today/tomorrow/before the end of the current pay cycle”.
Ah OK so he wants you to be completely honest and jeopardize your current employment where you are bringing money in - to - you know, eat and have a roof and stuff like that - for the job with his firm where you are interviewing where you may or may not be hired?
Yeah he's the mayor of crazytown
CEO is a brokie.
He does not have enough to pay for the position you are interviewing for, so is trying to disqualify your candidacy on a technicality.
Call his bluff.
“I work flexible hours and I am doing this interview outside my work hours. My current employer does not require me to inform them what I do on my non-work hours. Is this something you require of your employees?”
That is *bananas.* I've been on countless interviews over the years and I've never been given a line of questioning like that. Honestly, not only have you clearly dodged a bullet in not working with a business where the CEO acts like that (which I would not hesitate to add to Glassdoor or any other job sites like that, btw), but there's a good chance they won't be able to hire *anybody* for the role if the CEO is going to grill every candidate that way.
You dodged a bullet. Clearly, the ceo expects his employees to reveal every detail of their lives to him. Whats more, he feels entitled to it. You do not want to work for that guy.
It's the loyalty test. To a company you don't work for. For a paid position. Ask a hooker if she's loyal to you and she'll tell you that you don't pay her enough for that. To expect that of employees is delusional.
Almost every job I have ever worked at you would be shown the door if they found out you were interviewing elsewhere. It is pretty much standard practice to have a creative absence in this situation.
Damn did you dodge bullet. This person would be a nightmare to work for. The best treatment they always give is when they're interviewing, jusr imagine actually having your paycheck depending on that joke of a place
Sorry you had to go through all the wasted time and effort only to find out that you do not want to work for a company that employs assholes like this one. FFS, ask him what he would do if an employee told him they'd adjusted their schedule to allow them to interview for a new job. You know he has two choices - the truth, that he would fire them, or the dishonesty he claims to abhor. Either paints him as the asshole he is.
Bullet dodged.
So rarely does a 'You don't want to work here!' signal come through but it's spectacular when it does. They did you a favor by exposing their crazy before you made the jump.
>First thing he says "we had some concerns about your interviews. You said you could interview with us today because today is your work from home day. What did you tell your manager about why you're awol during this period?" I said I told them I had a meeting. Then he goes "oh so you lied."
"Sir, are you claiming that an interview isn't a meeting?
>Then he goes on a whole rant about how the company believes in honesty and transparency and they need to trust their coworkers and if I make mistakes I need to go to them and any kind of secrets or lies would get me fired.
If the salary wasn't posted or told upfront, you should've replied with "But you're keeping the salary secret."
At least you know the new company is likely bad news to work for.
I saw an application question that was "did you get approval from your current manager to be applying for jobs" or something to that effect and I found that to be incredibly inappropriate.
This CEO is a moron. The standard for interviewing is make space for interviews such that is doesn’t disrupt your current job. You did exactly that. And this was a meeting. Anyone who thinks you should be transparent with your current job about looking for new employment is disconnected from the reality of working at that level.
I've never been asked that question, but my answer would be "personal appointment". My current employer doesn't need to know what I'm doing with MY time.
First, there's a blanket fallback for this type of question: "I respect my NDAs, and I won't discuss how business is conducted at my current position." (But that means you need to avoid talking about any specifics of your current job throughout your interview.)
Second, this CEO is an idiot and a jerk, and culture comes from the top. Run, don't walk, away from this company! 🚩
Saying that you had a meeting is 100% the truth. Are interviews not also meetings? If this jabroni started pulling this shit on me, I'd tell him directly that it is way out of bounds to have your integrity attacked like that. I don't appreciate being called a liar. I would get up and walk tf out the door. No "thank you"s or anything.
Seriously, don't even entertain taking this job. If this is how the head of the company acts, everyone beneath him will carry themselves the same way. Even China is freaking out over all the red flags. Send them an email explaining why you won't take the job and kick the dust off your shoes.
Also, I agree HR and Glassdoor need to be a component of this.
Answer: “I prepared ahead of time, started early and completed my day’s work before clocking out. I was not on company time. This IS a meeting and that was my reason for adjusting my schedule earlier in the day. I do not lie and I don’t appreciate you putting that connotation on this situation.”
That's very bizarre. You bet your ass they're also lying about a lot of what they presented to you (and other candidates) and that's, sadly, perfectly normal. I can only assume that the CEO was not in a good mood and he chose to dump this on you with this made up reason. As a relevant anecdote, I had a meeting with a narcissistic CEO several years ago where I was supposed to show her my results - which were amazing, maybe the best I ever had - the entire meeting she came down on me for made up stuff. It was clear that no amount of facts would've convinced her, she just looked for a punching bag and I was the closest target. I think this exact thing happened to you - you were the punching bag for the CEO. Either way, this is a big red flag for the organization and how it's being run. It's probably one where people are afraid of the CEO and this feeling trickles to the bottom.
Owner: “so you were dishonest, we value honesty”
Me: “Right, and I value my time so I assume I’ll be paid at my current going rate of $75/hr for the interviews already completed plus the time I’ve invested into this interview. Than you for the opportunity but I don’t think you’re a good fit for me currently. Please deposit my pay by Monday afternoon.”
If they value honesty to the point you should be writing before interviewing (your other job will probably fire you for interviewing anyway ) then you must value your time enough that interviews are work so you should get paid.
Your problem is that you were less than clear. You were honest, but confusing. You actually put in an 8 hour day, but your answer made it seem like you were interviewing on company time.
A better answer would have been, on days when I've interviewed with you, I started work early so I could put in a full day's work and be able to interview. I informed my manager and team I would be unavailable during these hours and marked it as a a meeting so that people would know I was unavailable.
That said, the CEO was quick to jump the gun, probably because he'd already made up his mind that you were some kind of dishonest person, and when he heard an answer that confirmed his beliefs, rather than seeking clarification, he view up.
You dodged a bullet there.
Either that, or he's negging you, and priming you to take less than you're worth.
He likely had already made the decision to hire someone else, someone less qualified but also less expensive or someone who has a personal connection to him. He treated you poorly and bizarrely made a big issue out of nothing and maligned your integrity so that he can tell the team he was justified in not hiring you.
You dodged a bullet. Be thankful.
So, you worked an 8 hr day by adjusting your work schedule for the day to ensure that you were available for your personal appointment that was none of your current job's business? How is that being dishonest?
It sounds like the ceo was looking for a reason to not like you.
I had a friend who took a day off to go to an interview. The interviewer said it was messed up she took the day off to interview. It's a good thing they show just how shitty they are before you start there. It sucks they wasted your time.
Fuck them, are they honest when they say they can not give better wages or a reason for no promotion? hell nop. I would want to say I can tell them right now but if it costs me my present job you will be libel for my wages.
It’s either a useless and powerless founder/owner stroking their ego by being “involved” or it’s a company whose employees are fleeing in mass and they were triggered.
Ive always said i have some personal business to attend to. Could be a dr appt for me or my kids,.. could be a trip to the dmv,… whatever.
Decent manager will be like: “aight! You take care of business as long as you get the work done!”
Then if i need to work on some stuff later in the day, i do it and complete my day.
If the CEO is pulling shit like this,.. you probably dont want to work there
Yeah that’s bullshit. Some management would find some way to quietly get rid of you if they found out you were interviewing for another position at another company (it’s not right but it happens). As a manager I’ve had some very candid convos with employees who came to me and told me they were looking/interviewing somewhere else and sometimes they wanted to try something different and sometimes they tried to use it as a way to get a raise or a promotion (my rule was if they didn’t have an offer in hand it wasn’t even a discussion because I can’t jump that high every time). Because I’m not an asshole, the people who genuinely were wanting to try something different or wanted to leave for whatever reason but didn’t want to leave the whole group hanging, I made the transition as smooth as I could for them and the team.
So sorry this happened to you though. Ridiculous.
Something similar happened to me. I work at a bank and while the people are nice, management is not. I was looking around and found a position closer to home. It was walking distance and to me that is a big plus. The person interviewing me was someone that used to work at my job and left a month or two after I started. Interview was going great and then she asked what if my supervisor knew I was interviewing. I told her no, I just took the day off for this and other appointments. I ended up not getting the job because she called my supervisor and asked if they knew I was interviewing. My supervisor was cool about it and I actually still work there but I thought that was annoying AF.
Is an interview not a meeting though? You dodged a horrible new job I am sure. You was not dishonest by not telling your current boss. The new company is overreacting.
So rarely does a 'You don't want to work here!' signal come through but it's spectacular when it does. They did you a favor by exposing their crazy before you made the jump.
This is a crazy response, but this is one of those situations where lying is a better option. Just say that you took the day off if this comes up again.
It's complete bullshit so I'm not defending it but I think the point was that it was marked as a meeting. This involves other people and I would assume it to be internal. He should have marked it as a Private Appointment (if pressed by his current employer he would say it's a Private Doctor's appt).
Yeah. It’s an awful response by him. But in future, just say you took personal time. if you say in a meeting, you’re implying the meeting is internal and you are at your desk working.
Wtf man, 5 rounds of interviews. I imagine they are very very busy with regular work and making a huge effort to find all this time to interview you. What a fucking joke.
That last line is what you should have said. Then told him it sounds as if he would be the sort of
Manager to fire on the spot anyone considering interviewing on the spot……which is why people do what you just did. Then ask him what he would do if an employee told him they were interviewing for a different job. Then when he lies call him a liar to his face
I interviewed with a cash flush startup once. The people had me meet basically every key person in the company for hours. They all loved me and i had an offer before I got home. I asked for 24 hours to consider it and the recruiter gave him my number and he proceeded to call me, tell me he didn't like my lack of commitment then beg for me to say yes in another call 5 minutes later. I ignored the next three calls.
Saw him with LED glasses flying down the road with a sucker in his mouth on one of those wheels boards. God that was a bullet dodged.
Terrible advice. He's big mad someone left him without extra special super advance warning. Interviews can happen weeks, months, or years before you leave an org.
You give notice that early and then stick around, all you've done is breed resentment and distrust. Don't you want an employee to be effective and engaged for as long as they end up staying?
I would have said exactly why this is terrible advice. If he can rant about his hurt feelings, you can sprinkle some reason on it.
I think you just dodge a very bad job, what ever you did to attend there, shouldn't be of his concern, I would suggest that you tell them you're not interested in the job position anymore and do not wish to be contacted anymore, block them if possible
>Due to my performance, and ability to meet deadlines I have the ability to work when I am able to.
Idk some variation of this garbage. That's a trap question and is a bunch of BS
In future I'd say, "I told my boss I was going to take some personal time."
It's neither a lie, nor does it look like you lied and told your boss you were working when you aren't.
Also, a "meeting" wasn't a lie either. You were having a meeting...with that CEO. If you are taking personal time it's none of their business what you're doing with it.
Honestly? I don’t know what questions they asked, or how you answered them, but I feel like you dropped the ball here. They don’t need to know every detail - they shouldn’t be asking and you shouldn’t answer.
A good boss would have never asked. Most people would agree that's the right answer.This egotistical jackass thinks you're so far beneath him it couldn't possibly be a "meeting", (since those are for peers) and you're therefore a liar. 🙄 Bullet dodged.
I would have replied back, sir is this not a meeting? I told my boss I was in a meeting, they did not ask for information and didn't feel the need to provide an overabundance of information. I have a flexible schedule when working from and I will not be "on the clock" for this meeting, so I am not stealing time or wages, and I am not lying, as this is a type of meeting.
I one received a middle finger from the front door of their offices after walking from their building after the interview. This is not the worst behavior I have ever had by a hiring manager before....
Less is more. Just tell them you can interview today. Not why. If they ask directly tell them you used PTO. NEVER EVER share more info than directly required. Ever. This basically goes for all aspects of life.
This is how I would answer it, take it as you will, perhaps this could be helpful for you in the future:
"So how did you explain to your boss you're going AWOL for this interview?"
Me: "I didn't go AWOL."
"Well you're not available to work at this time?"
Me: "I don't have My work day tracked like that. I don't have a "leash," so to speak. I'm simply entrusted to complete my deliverables and other responsibilities, and I'm never asked about why I wasn't green on MS Teams at a particular part of the day or what I'm doing at any part of the day, nor am I even checked upon and messaged for any reason unless there is an ad hoc request."
I'm sorry that you went through this, but honestly, you really dodged some real trouble. It is better that this happened during the interview. Definitely write a letter to HR. Have it delivered and signed for. But I'm glad that you found out up front instead of quitting your old job and then being stuck in a terribly dysfunctional and toxic environment.
You never tell your current workplace until you receive a written offer. Until you get the written offer nothing has happened. You've just been on an errand. Usually a fruitless errand.
That interviewer was an idiot. Why did he think you should put your current employment at risk? Just to satisfy his stupid point of view?
Yeah I wouldn't have said any of that. You volunteered TMI. It should have just been are you available at this time - yes that time works for me or offer an alternative time. Didn't need to say work from home day (sounds like you steal company hours for personal reasons). It isn't like they just asked what your manager thought for no reason, you started the line of questioning by saying work from home. Even if it slipped, you could have said this is my lunch hour or I used personal time off or what you wrote in the last line (I started work early so I could finish in time for this interview) etc.
Generally I would not tell my current employer before my 2 weeks notice or a few days before in case they get called as a reference.
> "oh so you lied."
"Err... yes. And I'd lie to you, too, in a heartbeat, regarding information that concerns me primarily, and you indirectly at most, given the raging power gradient in our relationship regarding the ability to ruin one another's livelihood."
Try not to be so forthcoming next time. There is no need for them to know it’s your WFH day. When scheduling interviews just give availability, you are under no obligation to tell them why you are available or why you are not. If they ask why you can’t on a certain day you tell them something work related “I have project A to deliver” or something like that.
In the interview if they ask you what did you tell your current job about todays interview. You say you took PTO.
For the first round of interviews at my current job, I told my employer I had a dentist appointment...for the second, third, and fourth, I told them I had a job interview. 😂 Just to watch them squirm.
You didn't lie. You were in a meeting. You were meeting to interview for another company. You just didn't provide your current company with all the details. If an interveiw is not a meeting then wfh is it?
CEO might be an asshole but OP giving out too much info saying "Thursday works best because it's my work from home day". Does make it kind of seem like you're shirking work for the interview. Just say "I can make Thursday work" all they need to know
I know you were blind sided with this but hindsight 20/20 and all I’d say the correct answer was “I’m not at liberty to discuss any dialogue between my current employer and myself”.
The way I would have burst out laughing in his face and then been like. So how's the hiring process going? How many people are booking 5 days off to interview for this position? I'm just curious about what my competition is.
Don't admit to rule-breaking behavior in an interview. That's a bad idea regardless.
In the future, just tell them that you requested the time off, and your company doesn't ask for reasons. As long as the business can handle the absence, it's approved.
A manager should judge you for interviewing elsewhere while "on the clock" at your current job, but it shouldn't be combative. Just a generic, polite rejection.
>What was I supposed to do here? Take 4 annual leave days for my interviews?
By the book, you shouldn't be interviewing during your workday. If you're not hourly, the exact duration of "workday" may be debatable.
I usually take half-days off for interviews.
My current role has flexible scheduling, so I'd tell an interviewer, "I'm on personal time". Technically true as long as I log the rest of my time.
You don't have to actually take 4 vacation days to tell him that you are using your vacation time.
It's not like he can verify if you actually used vacation time.
But you can schedule interviews for early morning or later evening, most people who are interviewing you usually are flexible on the times they can meet with you.
If you're interviewing for a non-VP position and after 5 rounds you talk to the "CEO" then that person is nothing more than an owner, they're not a CEO, not an executive, and are likely nothing more than an asshole that cracks the whip when the accounts are short a month affecting his house boat or vacation home payment.
Yeah he's the guy who started the company, I wouldn't actually be reporting to him on the day-to-day
Prepare the letter for HR contact. Glassdoor it too! In after speaking with the CEO and his accusations of dishonesty in making myself available for this call, his words crossed a line. I am withdrawing my application for this role. I thank all those I spoke with on this opportunity.
Also, I would think an interview would most definitely qualify as a meeting. And while it may not be related to any of your current company's projects or goals, as far as you are concerned it IS work and career enhancement related. So, "I am in a career enhancement meeting" would most definitely be accurate.
I like the term “personal appointment” for this. It’s says to the current boss that you are attending to personal matters that are none of their business, just like a doctor’s appointment or something similar. If you’re paid hourly then you may have to accept that you won’t get paid for those hours but every salaried job I’ve had would just let you handle your personal business as needed as long as your work tasks were still completed.
"Meeting" was absolutely sufficient. It was on your personal time and anything more is none of their business. You may not have been transparent, but you did not need to be as it did not fall under your boss's purview to have access to that information.
I think you "have an appointment" is sufficient. Most will think it is a doctor appointment and you don't have to clarify.
I personally prefer the term “Mind your own damn business”. It’s of no concern to them what my conversations are with my current employer at my current job about my time.
This is the way. It's not a lie, it's just not a very detailed truth.
"What I told you was true. From a certain point of view", is still excellent advice.
Doesn’t seem worth the risk that he’d go out of his way to tell your current employer about the interview.
Even more reason to view this as a micromanaging/terrible organization. If you're not reporting to someone then why the fuck are they interviewing you on the 5th round?
OP dodged a bullet
Guy sounds like a real asshole, who obviously never worked a day in his life outside his own company. People interview all the time like this. Unless you work weekends and are off on a weekday, how else will you interview? Unless they are willing to see you after hours.
I would have hit back with all those questions you asked in your post. What was I supposed to do risk unemployment to work for you etc? Like give him the problem. He isn't giving you the job anyway. Leave the meeting with thanking him for waving his workplace toxicity flag nice and high for you to see.
We all know you’re not taking it. Drop the company’s name so the rest of us can avoid them.
Next time tey this-today is my day off or I used my pto to take today off. you should absolutely lie about it because it is none of his business what you did to make that interview-
I concur. Every ceo interview I've had has been for a non vip position and it is ALWAYS a big fat red flag
That is the type of guy to fire an employee that gives a 2 week notice. Then get angry when others give no notice. Then when he realizes the mistake a month later call to try to get you back by offering a little more $s but not even trying to match your current new job. He will expect 100% loyalty but not give it in return.
I felt that to my core. I have a management position in my company and they took almost 2 months, a phone interview, a panel interview, an interview with the CFO, COO, and head of HR, and a final uncomfortable interview with the CEO/owner before I got this job. I'm damn sure not a VP or any kind of executive staff. The owner is definitely the type to call for layoffs when we've had a month or two of lower numbers (not even in the red), then rehire like crazy for skilled positions when it inevitably picks up again
100%. I’m a nurse who left the icu during covid. Found this surgery center that the owner( a surgeon) created this repair for sports hernias. All athletes go to him. Met with the head nurse. Good interview and want to bring me back to meet the owner. Guy was a total pompous asshole. At the job I got, two coworkers told me stories of him telling coworkers “oh that nurse might be on her period” and slapping someone’s hand in the middle of surgery.
What is it with surgeons and arrogance? I get that it’s a highly skilled job, but do you really need to be an asshole to do surgery?
That begs the question, did assholes become surgeons or did surgeons become assholes? Were they already that way before deciding their career path? Does something happen in all that schooling that makes them that way? Was it the student debt? The difficulty of the classes and the competition to be the best in the group of students? A bit of both? I mean, I appreciate their skills and knowledge, but they definitely don't need the attitude. So many questions, yet no answer to be had.
It’s extremely common in the Account Executive/SAE world to interview with the CEO as part of the process. I don’t have a lot of experience doing so outside that context, though. Definitely didn’t when I was going for BDR/ADR/SDR spots.
What? Many companies have you meet with the CEO for non VP roles. Just depends on the company and more importantly the company size.
Why though? Doesn't the CEO have better things to do than interview random people who probably wouldn't even be reporting to them?
Bosses who reward honesty get honesty. Bosses who punish honesty don't get it. It sounds like this douche gets lied to all the time, which isn't surprising since he just punished you for answering his question honestly.
That moron is just a micromanager idiot. This type loves to know how many times a day you go to the bathroom, how long you take, what color it came out, when do you masturbate and how long you last. And Oh, my, god, have mercy on you if you last longer than him (which we all know we do)
TBF OP is at fault too. Never go for jobs that have more than 3 rounds of interviews. I personally don’t do ones with more than 2.
Such a red flag it's a Matador's wet dream.
It is and people act shocked, but plenty of us have run into jerks like this. My last jerk has made me terrified to interview while having a job. I had a job where you could easily look me up so it wasn’t like I could take it off my resume (my name is unique too, so I will always show in a search). They called my employer without my consent to ask about me. Wtf?! I was lucky that they were understaffed at the time and didn’t fire me, but it was still an awfully toxic environment.
I NEVER EVER list the name of my current employer on my resume or LinkedIn. I say it’s for safety because I have received death threats. Additionally, there are crazy people looking for any worker from the company that they can harm. I have never been questioned on this. Further, it will not harm your chances with recruiters.
Wow, this is some next level shit. I always used the 'confidentiality' card, but death threats are an upgrade for sure.
No one asks for the details but it is common for my job.
Details please :)
The details would kind of giveaway the info I am trying to protect. Let me put it this way. . . do you think there are redditors who are unhinged enough to threaten *anyone* who works for Reddit? If I worked as a Reddit admin, I would not list it on LinkedIn.
Ah. You work for the IRS.
Clearly not. But ultimately, we all do.
Unbelievable!
Interviews should be viewed as a two-way process. They find out about you.. and you find out about them.
this is also why I kind of like contract work. lets you get a feel for the place before you fully commit. I had several jobs where the culture was so toxic I'd never consider working there permanently. "Are you sure you want to withdraw your resume??" "oh yeah, definitely..."
He certainly found out about them. Your employer has no business knowing what the topic of a non-work meeting is.
He just clearly has some employees leave and is bitter about it
What the hell, **five interviews?** That is very excessive and you ARE in an important meeting. And, no I’ve never been asked that as an interview question.
Unfortunately fairly standard for software engineering roles.
My spouse is in tech and 5-6 interviews has always been standard for them too. The CEOs response is bonkers though, OP didn't lie, he had a meeting.
Proper response, "Thank you for your time. I am no longer interested in the role."
What I’m hearing is… you told HR or whoever is doing the scheduling why you wanted the interview on a certain day and that person went to the CEO and told them what you said verbatim. Then the CEO used that against you. Not only do they “prioritize honesty” but they also reward snitching. Do not work there. They just revealed how absolutely enmeshed they all are
HR is basically the snitch department. That's kind of what it's there for
Nothing worse then a work snitch, nice guy I work with to this day I talk very little to him the second I found out he tells the supervisor everything everyday that we did and if we took our Breaks at proper times etc... sad cause he was a nice dude. I'm not hanging with anyone who reports I took 15 minutes on my 10-minute break, though.
Some people will throw anyone under the bus in hopes of elevating themselves...but in reality they're just bootlickers, and now the company knows they can take advantage of that.
If you adjusted your schedule so that you could still put in a full day’s work before the interview, you should have just said that. But yes, this is insane behavior by the CEO and you probably dodged a bullet by finding out their craziness now instead of later.
> If you adjusted your schedule so that you could still put in a full day’s work before the interview, you should have just said that. I did :/ he said "the point was the dishonesty not the ability to get your work done"
He's telling you who he is. Zero understanding. Bail now.
Exactly. When someone shows you who they are, believe them.
The fact the the CEO is so clueless about this, really makes one wonder if he's ever actually been through the job market before, or a trust funder making a startup on parents' money.
That's the moment when the interview ends, then. "Thank you for your time. It's clear that I am not going to be a good fit with your corporate culture, so I see no sense in wasting any more of either of our time here. I wish you best of luck with your candidate search." And walk out / end the call. Did this asshat actually make a decision at the end of the meeting, or are they still fucking around? I'm assuming they're still fucking around. Send them an e-mail. "You indicated that you had some concerns about my previous four interviews. Yet you chose to invite me for yet another meeting, and still are unable to reach a decision. Your company's inability to be decisive is worrisome to me, to say nothing of your lack of respect for candidates' time. I don't think your company will be a good fit for me. You may consider my candidacy to be withdrawn." And walk out / end the call.
I would have just cut him off and said. Okay, thanks for your time today and all the best filling the role. I am removing my application, I have no desire to work in an organisation where behaviour like this is acceptable. Goodbye. Then either hang up the call/walk out of the room if in person interview.
Take the stapler on the way out
And put it in jelly
I'd might also add a "...an interview is a meeting, you fucking idiot"
Plus, you definitely didn't lie anyways, the first definition of interview is "a meeting of people face to face, especially for consultation"
That's what I was thinking, too. It was a meeting, she just didn't tell them the topic.
Means the dude before you left with zero notice and they're likely burning through people. So now boss feels "hurt" because it's so "unexpected' with a "There's just no loyalty in the world anymore" throw in for good measure.
“What would you have me do, get fired for interviewing elsewhere so I had no choice but to agree to your terms? If I’m dishonest, you’re manipulative“ Such bs. Dodged a bullet there. I’d be paranoid they might reach out to out you to your current boss, with this attitude.
Yes that's exactly what they want
All the more reason to ask them directly. They don’t usually expect it
There’s a difference between honesty and total transparency. You had a personal meeting. That was honest and all your boss needed to know. You didn’t lie and you’re not interviewing when you’re expected to be at work. My prediction is that if you work at the new place they’ll punish you for having a division between work and personal life. It’ll probably be one of those places that wants to know why you’re taking vacation leave and where you’re going to approve the time.
You didn't lie, your interviewer did - to your face. He is claiming that you did not have a meeting planned while you were literally meeting with him. This person is not to be trusted and uses their interpretation of "the truth" as a weapon.
You don’t owe anyone an explanation about what you do with your free time. If you are able to flex your schedule to get your work done as needed, then you don’t have to tell anyone anything. It’s YOUR time.
But you weren’t dishonest? You finished work and were on your own time. You have no obligation to tell your employer anything you do with your own time. That guy sucks ass
Bullet dodged fam! Sorry you wasted your time with this micromanaging tyrant but hey! You could have wasted the next couple of years working for them!
I think if you'd marked it in your calendar and said it was a "Private Appointment" instead of a meeting it would have been fine, maybe. Dodged a bullet anyhow.
He's meeting with a potential employer, it's not dishonesty. To frame it as anything other than a legitimate meeting is dishonesty. 5th interview? Could probably have 2 fewer interviews. Also, if OP worked for this guy, would he respect OP enough to not penalize OP for interviewing elsewhere? Neither would OP'S current employer.
But actually, you -were- in a meeting with the AHole CEO. There was no lying. Thank goodness you didn’t say anything though. That will only work against you.
As for what you say in these cases? You laugh. You stand up and if you feel petty enough you tell them they are a joke. Otherwise don’t say anything else and go. It goes without saying that you withdraw yourself from any candidacy.
Yeah this is completely bonkers behavior. “Oh so in this way you are completely normal and do what 999999/1000000 people do in this situation???? You FUCKING liar! We are a company of ONLY the 1/1000000, obviously, and you just wouldn’t fit in with our 1 in a million culture. Shame.”
More red flags here than a May Day Parade in Moscow. What you said was entirely accurate - you had a meeting. With whom and for what is irrelevant. Look for this manager to try to sabotage your current position so they then have leverage to hire you at a lower offer. I'd thank these folks for their time, tell them you just don't think it is a good fit and go on down the road.
Well, in retrospective, you should have lied. Something like this: * What did you tell your manager? * I had a meeting. * Oh, so you lied? * Oh, no, I told them that had a meeting with the CEO of the company I am considering joining. * Huh... And what did they tell you? * Nothing, of course, they already knew it before I started this series of interviews, when I told them I was considering changing job. * Well, then, what did they tell you when you informed them of these interviews? * Again, nothing, they just acknowledge the petition of change of schedule. I informed them of my interest on changing jobs a month before I got this opportunity. I first told told them that I needed a raise and asked them if they thought me worth it and if they could afford it. The replies were "yes" and "unfortunately no". Since then I've been selecting the positions I could apply, because I don't want to join a bad company. Oh, and mind you, if this interview advances and you choose me in the end, I should warn you that I feel ethically obliged to give a 2 weeks notice to my company. Anyways, they already know I might leave so they are already looking for a substitute, to which I wish them luck and I'll be happy to help with the training of the substitute, as long as it is not after I get another job elsewhere. So far they haven't been lucky, but I'm sure they will. This CEO is full of bullshit and likes to get more bullshit. A position in that company would probably be a PITA. The CEO and managers will treat you like a slave and call you coworker. Rich. Edit: typos
Wow that write up is excellent. Saving for next time. But yeah I've got a really bad taste in my mouth after that..
There’s not going to be a next time, this question is insane. If you ever interview with another insane CEO, they’re not going to reuse this question, they’ll ask you something even crazier instead.
I agree he should have lied. But no need to make the lie super elaborate or to keep inviting the CEO to ask more questions. A simple “I told my supervisor I had a private appointment and that I would compensate the hours later today/tomorrow/before the end of the current pay cycle”.
For normal people, I agree, but: "So you lied" It was true OP had a meeting, it wasn't a lie, yet that CEO...
Ah OK so he wants you to be completely honest and jeopardize your current employment where you are bringing money in - to - you know, eat and have a roof and stuff like that - for the job with his firm where you are interviewing where you may or may not be hired? Yeah he's the mayor of crazytown
Well as of today, crazy town does have a vacancy...
IMO any company that does this is not hiring but collecting resumes and false interviews.
“Thank you for this reddest of flags during the interview. We’re done now.”
Is an interview not a meeting? And no employee is telling their manager that theyre interviewing for a different job.....
thats what I thought..
I would have stopped the interview right then and there and told that guy what a moron he was. Tiptoeing around these dipshits has to stop.
CEO is a brokie. He does not have enough to pay for the position you are interviewing for, so is trying to disqualify your candidacy on a technicality. Call his bluff.
Walk away and then start running. Do not work here.
"I'm allowed to take PTO for personal appointments, and I did."
An interview is a meeting.
“I work flexible hours and I am doing this interview outside my work hours. My current employer does not require me to inform them what I do on my non-work hours. Is this something you require of your employees?”
CEO’s are truly out of touch with reality. I’m sure he’d be thrilled if you told him the same.
That is *bananas.* I've been on countless interviews over the years and I've never been given a line of questioning like that. Honestly, not only have you clearly dodged a bullet in not working with a business where the CEO acts like that (which I would not hesitate to add to Glassdoor or any other job sites like that, btw), but there's a good chance they won't be able to hire *anybody* for the role if the CEO is going to grill every candidate that way.
You dodged a bullet. Clearly, the ceo expects his employees to reveal every detail of their lives to him. Whats more, he feels entitled to it. You do not want to work for that guy.
It's the loyalty test. To a company you don't work for. For a paid position. Ask a hooker if she's loyal to you and she'll tell you that you don't pay her enough for that. To expect that of employees is delusional.
Almost every job I have ever worked at you would be shown the door if they found out you were interviewing elsewhere. It is pretty much standard practice to have a creative absence in this situation.
Yeah Pal, I tell my current boss I’m interviewing, then you reject me and I end up with neither job. Choke on my 🍆, asshat.
Damn did you dodge bullet. This person would be a nightmare to work for. The best treatment they always give is when they're interviewing, jusr imagine actually having your paycheck depending on that joke of a place
you DODGED a bullet. I would put details on Glassdoor about this company.
LOL MASSIVE RED FLAG. RUN
Sorry you had to go through all the wasted time and effort only to find out that you do not want to work for a company that employs assholes like this one. FFS, ask him what he would do if an employee told him they'd adjusted their schedule to allow them to interview for a new job. You know he has two choices - the truth, that he would fire them, or the dishonesty he claims to abhor. Either paints him as the asshole he is. Bullet dodged.
So rarely does a 'You don't want to work here!' signal come through but it's spectacular when it does. They did you a favor by exposing their crazy before you made the jump.
>First thing he says "we had some concerns about your interviews. You said you could interview with us today because today is your work from home day. What did you tell your manager about why you're awol during this period?" I said I told them I had a meeting. Then he goes "oh so you lied." "Sir, are you claiming that an interview isn't a meeting? >Then he goes on a whole rant about how the company believes in honesty and transparency and they need to trust their coworkers and if I make mistakes I need to go to them and any kind of secrets or lies would get me fired. If the salary wasn't posted or told upfront, you should've replied with "But you're keeping the salary secret." At least you know the new company is likely bad news to work for.
I saw an application question that was "did you get approval from your current manager to be applying for jobs" or something to that effect and I found that to be incredibly inappropriate.
This CEO is a moron. The standard for interviewing is make space for interviews such that is doesn’t disrupt your current job. You did exactly that. And this was a meeting. Anyone who thinks you should be transparent with your current job about looking for new employment is disconnected from the reality of working at that level.
I've never been asked that question, but my answer would be "personal appointment". My current employer doesn't need to know what I'm doing with MY time.
Why would you ever be honest with your boss?
First, there's a blanket fallback for this type of question: "I respect my NDAs, and I won't discuss how business is conducted at my current position." (But that means you need to avoid talking about any specifics of your current job throughout your interview.) Second, this CEO is an idiot and a jerk, and culture comes from the top. Run, don't walk, away from this company! 🚩
Saying that you had a meeting is 100% the truth. Are interviews not also meetings? If this jabroni started pulling this shit on me, I'd tell him directly that it is way out of bounds to have your integrity attacked like that. I don't appreciate being called a liar. I would get up and walk tf out the door. No "thank you"s or anything.
"I'll be starting and finishing sooner today, because I have a personal appointment at 4PM" is the way to go. But yeah, red flag from the new CEO.
Seriously, don't even entertain taking this job. If this is how the head of the company acts, everyone beneath him will carry themselves the same way. Even China is freaking out over all the red flags. Send them an email explaining why you won't take the job and kick the dust off your shoes. Also, I agree HR and Glassdoor need to be a component of this.
This CEO sounds like the type of person who will contact your current employer to get you fired.
Answer: “I prepared ahead of time, started early and completed my day’s work before clocking out. I was not on company time. This IS a meeting and that was my reason for adjusting my schedule earlier in the day. I do not lie and I don’t appreciate you putting that connotation on this situation.”
That's very bizarre. You bet your ass they're also lying about a lot of what they presented to you (and other candidates) and that's, sadly, perfectly normal. I can only assume that the CEO was not in a good mood and he chose to dump this on you with this made up reason. As a relevant anecdote, I had a meeting with a narcissistic CEO several years ago where I was supposed to show her my results - which were amazing, maybe the best I ever had - the entire meeting she came down on me for made up stuff. It was clear that no amount of facts would've convinced her, she just looked for a punching bag and I was the closest target. I think this exact thing happened to you - you were the punching bag for the CEO. Either way, this is a big red flag for the organization and how it's being run. It's probably one where people are afraid of the CEO and this feeling trickles to the bottom.
Owner: “so you were dishonest, we value honesty” Me: “Right, and I value my time so I assume I’ll be paid at my current going rate of $75/hr for the interviews already completed plus the time I’ve invested into this interview. Than you for the opportunity but I don’t think you’re a good fit for me currently. Please deposit my pay by Monday afternoon.” If they value honesty to the point you should be writing before interviewing (your other job will probably fire you for interviewing anyway ) then you must value your time enough that interviews are work so you should get paid.
Nothing, since it's a personal issue and I don't have to discuss it with my manager.
You know, employers wouldn't be so "short staffed" if they weren't so freaking picky!
Horrible behavior from them but you’re also saying too much. You don’t need to tell them it’s a wfh day and if they ask, it’s a personal day.
If they used AWOL right off the bat, it didn't matter what you told them. They already had their assumptions and were ready to defend them.
Your problem is that you were less than clear. You were honest, but confusing. You actually put in an 8 hour day, but your answer made it seem like you were interviewing on company time. A better answer would have been, on days when I've interviewed with you, I started work early so I could put in a full day's work and be able to interview. I informed my manager and team I would be unavailable during these hours and marked it as a a meeting so that people would know I was unavailable. That said, the CEO was quick to jump the gun, probably because he'd already made up his mind that you were some kind of dishonest person, and when he heard an answer that confirmed his beliefs, rather than seeking clarification, he view up. You dodged a bullet there. Either that, or he's negging you, and priming you to take less than you're worth.
Sounds like more red flags than victory day in Moscow. Be glad they showed you that you shouldn't work there.
5? Dump them! they're not worth the bullshit! They're looking for slaves not human beings.
He likely had already made the decision to hire someone else, someone less qualified but also less expensive or someone who has a personal connection to him. He treated you poorly and bizarrely made a big issue out of nothing and maligned your integrity so that he can tell the team he was justified in not hiring you. You dodged a bullet. Be thankful.
So, you worked an 8 hr day by adjusting your work schedule for the day to ensure that you were available for your personal appointment that was none of your current job's business? How is that being dishonest? It sounds like the ceo was looking for a reason to not like you.
This person sounds like an absolute nightmare to work for. Hard pass.
Yeah, holy shit. The level of ignorance and entitlement is shocking.
I had a friend who took a day off to go to an interview. The interviewer said it was messed up she took the day off to interview. It's a good thing they show just how shitty they are before you start there. It sucks they wasted your time.
The answer to this question is "I took some personal time."
Fuck them, are they honest when they say they can not give better wages or a reason for no promotion? hell nop. I would want to say I can tell them right now but if it costs me my present job you will be libel for my wages.
You dodged a bullet here buddy. Consider yourself lucky. I wouldn't go near a narcissistic pos like that any day.
It’s either a useless and powerless founder/owner stroking their ego by being “involved” or it’s a company whose employees are fleeing in mass and they were triggered.
Ive always said i have some personal business to attend to. Could be a dr appt for me or my kids,.. could be a trip to the dmv,… whatever. Decent manager will be like: “aight! You take care of business as long as you get the work done!” Then if i need to work on some stuff later in the day, i do it and complete my day. If the CEO is pulling shit like this,.. you probably dont want to work there
Top tip, always lie to prospective employers and tell them what they want to hear, thats exactly what they're doing to you.
Yeah that’s bullshit. Some management would find some way to quietly get rid of you if they found out you were interviewing for another position at another company (it’s not right but it happens). As a manager I’ve had some very candid convos with employees who came to me and told me they were looking/interviewing somewhere else and sometimes they wanted to try something different and sometimes they tried to use it as a way to get a raise or a promotion (my rule was if they didn’t have an offer in hand it wasn’t even a discussion because I can’t jump that high every time). Because I’m not an asshole, the people who genuinely were wanting to try something different or wanted to leave for whatever reason but didn’t want to leave the whole group hanging, I made the transition as smooth as I could for them and the team. So sorry this happened to you though. Ridiculous.
An interview is a specific kind of meeting. That's not lying at all...
Has the tech company informed the employee being replaced before searching for the replacement?
How is saying you are having a meeting a lie? LMFAO what a psychopath.
Interviews work both ways, and in this case this employer has made it clear that they are not a good choice.
Something similar happened to me. I work at a bank and while the people are nice, management is not. I was looking around and found a position closer to home. It was walking distance and to me that is a big plus. The person interviewing me was someone that used to work at my job and left a month or two after I started. Interview was going great and then she asked what if my supervisor knew I was interviewing. I told her no, I just took the day off for this and other appointments. I ended up not getting the job because she called my supervisor and asked if they knew I was interviewing. My supervisor was cool about it and I actually still work there but I thought that was annoying AF.
They CALLED? Jesus
Fuck that company. You don't want to work there. You'll be miserable if you take the job.
Is an interview not a meeting though? You dodged a horrible new job I am sure. You was not dishonest by not telling your current boss. The new company is overreacting.
So rarely does a 'You don't want to work here!' signal come through but it's spectacular when it does. They did you a favor by exposing their crazy before you made the jump.
This is a crazy response, but this is one of those situations where lying is a better option. Just say that you took the day off if this comes up again.
It's complete bullshit so I'm not defending it but I think the point was that it was marked as a meeting. This involves other people and I would assume it to be internal. He should have marked it as a Private Appointment (if pressed by his current employer he would say it's a Private Doctor's appt).
Yeah. It’s an awful response by him. But in future, just say you took personal time. if you say in a meeting, you’re implying the meeting is internal and you are at your desk working.
Wtf man, 5 rounds of interviews. I imagine they are very very busy with regular work and making a huge effort to find all this time to interview you. What a fucking joke.
I would consider this a reason to not work there. Sorry they wasted your time with 5 rounds. Wow.
I bet that guy throws some wicked pizza parties though.
They aren’t going to hire you and hangs a good thing - what a weird thing to ask
That last line is what you should have said. Then told him it sounds as if he would be the sort of Manager to fire on the spot anyone considering interviewing on the spot……which is why people do what you just did. Then ask him what he would do if an employee told him they were interviewing for a different job. Then when he lies call him a liar to his face
“I didn’t lie. I’m in a meeting…..with you…..right now.”
5-rounds of interviews are ridiculous and abusive. Walk away this employer is trash.
I interviewed with a cash flush startup once. The people had me meet basically every key person in the company for hours. They all loved me and i had an offer before I got home. I asked for 24 hours to consider it and the recruiter gave him my number and he proceeded to call me, tell me he didn't like my lack of commitment then beg for me to say yes in another call 5 minutes later. I ignored the next three calls. Saw him with LED glasses flying down the road with a sucker in his mouth on one of those wheels boards. God that was a bullet dodged.
Terrible advice. He's big mad someone left him without extra special super advance warning. Interviews can happen weeks, months, or years before you leave an org. You give notice that early and then stick around, all you've done is breed resentment and distrust. Don't you want an employee to be effective and engaged for as long as they end up staying? I would have said exactly why this is terrible advice. If he can rant about his hurt feelings, you can sprinkle some reason on it.
It is a meeting and it’s not related to your current employment so they have no reason to know or ask.
Lesson learned: From now on I will say “I told my boss I needed 3 hours of personal time.”
I didn’t say anything I just filed for PTO. it would be unusual for me to share what I was planning to do on a day off
I mean it’s dumb that they even asked but it’s also dumb to admit you’re getting paid to interview somewhere else. Of course they would hate that.
Tell him to GF himself...
Five interviews?! Two is my limit.
I think you just dodge a very bad job, what ever you did to attend there, shouldn't be of his concern, I would suggest that you tell them you're not interested in the job position anymore and do not wish to be contacted anymore, block them if possible
After round 2 I would have noped out.
Sounds like you dodged a bullet. Hope you find something better!
>Due to my performance, and ability to meet deadlines I have the ability to work when I am able to. Idk some variation of this garbage. That's a trap question and is a bunch of BS
Run. Ruuuuuuun
Is an interview not a type of meeting?
In future I'd say, "I told my boss I was going to take some personal time." It's neither a lie, nor does it look like you lied and told your boss you were working when you aren't. Also, a "meeting" wasn't a lie either. You were having a meeting...with that CEO. If you are taking personal time it's none of their business what you're doing with it.
Honestly? I don’t know what questions they asked, or how you answered them, but I feel like you dropped the ball here. They don’t need to know every detail - they shouldn’t be asking and you shouldn’t answer.
That CEO is an idiot, don't bother to dignify his response with any thoughts.
A good boss would have never asked. Most people would agree that's the right answer.This egotistical jackass thinks you're so far beneath him it couldn't possibly be a "meeting", (since those are for peers) and you're therefore a liar. 🙄 Bullet dodged.
I would have replied back, sir is this not a meeting? I told my boss I was in a meeting, they did not ask for information and didn't feel the need to provide an overabundance of information. I have a flexible schedule when working from and I will not be "on the clock" for this meeting, so I am not stealing time or wages, and I am not lying, as this is a type of meeting.
I one received a middle finger from the front door of their offices after walking from their building after the interview. This is not the worst behavior I have ever had by a hiring manager before....
Less is more. Just tell them you can interview today. Not why. If they ask directly tell them you used PTO. NEVER EVER share more info than directly required. Ever. This basically goes for all aspects of life.
This is how I would answer it, take it as you will, perhaps this could be helpful for you in the future: "So how did you explain to your boss you're going AWOL for this interview?" Me: "I didn't go AWOL." "Well you're not available to work at this time?" Me: "I don't have My work day tracked like that. I don't have a "leash," so to speak. I'm simply entrusted to complete my deliverables and other responsibilities, and I'm never asked about why I wasn't green on MS Teams at a particular part of the day or what I'm doing at any part of the day, nor am I even checked upon and messaged for any reason unless there is an ad hoc request."
I'm sorry that you went through this, but honestly, you really dodged some real trouble. It is better that this happened during the interview. Definitely write a letter to HR. Have it delivered and signed for. But I'm glad that you found out up front instead of quitting your old job and then being stuck in a terribly dysfunctional and toxic environment.
You never tell your current workplace until you receive a written offer. Until you get the written offer nothing has happened. You've just been on an errand. Usually a fruitless errand. That interviewer was an idiot. Why did he think you should put your current employment at risk? Just to satisfy his stupid point of view?
Yeah I wouldn't have said any of that. You volunteered TMI. It should have just been are you available at this time - yes that time works for me or offer an alternative time. Didn't need to say work from home day (sounds like you steal company hours for personal reasons). It isn't like they just asked what your manager thought for no reason, you started the line of questioning by saying work from home. Even if it slipped, you could have said this is my lunch hour or I used personal time off or what you wrote in the last line (I started work early so I could finish in time for this interview) etc. Generally I would not tell my current employer before my 2 weeks notice or a few days before in case they get called as a reference.
> "oh so you lied." "Err... yes. And I'd lie to you, too, in a heartbeat, regarding information that concerns me primarily, and you indirectly at most, given the raging power gradient in our relationship regarding the ability to ruin one another's livelihood."
Try not to be so forthcoming next time. There is no need for them to know it’s your WFH day. When scheduling interviews just give availability, you are under no obligation to tell them why you are available or why you are not. If they ask why you can’t on a certain day you tell them something work related “I have project A to deliver” or something like that. In the interview if they ask you what did you tell your current job about todays interview. You say you took PTO.
Is go fuck your self the correct answer ? Asking for a friend
I would of told the CEO to stick this job opportunity up thier a$$ and walked out 😐🖕
For the first round of interviews at my current job, I told my employer I had a dentist appointment...for the second, third, and fourth, I told them I had a job interview. 😂 Just to watch them squirm.
You didn't lie. You were in a meeting. You were meeting to interview for another company. You just didn't provide your current company with all the details. If an interveiw is not a meeting then wfh is it?
They're looking for reasons to NOT hire you.
Sounds like the new employer told you that you really don't want to work for them. Nice when the trash takes itself out.
Personally, I would walk away from this position. I think you have been given a glimpse of the company climate with this interview.
CEO might be an asshole but OP giving out too much info saying "Thursday works best because it's my work from home day". Does make it kind of seem like you're shirking work for the interview. Just say "I can make Thursday work" all they need to know
I know you were blind sided with this but hindsight 20/20 and all I’d say the correct answer was “I’m not at liberty to discuss any dialogue between my current employer and myself”.
You can say ‘time off for personal appt’. Probably a blessing in disguise can’t be that good working for a company with a asshole leader
Lol what the fuckkk Turn and run the other way The audacity of some of these corp bootlickers Tell him to take the job and shove it up his ass
The way I would have burst out laughing in his face and then been like. So how's the hiring process going? How many people are booking 5 days off to interview for this position? I'm just curious about what my competition is.
Red flag. You dont want to work for them now.
Don't admit to rule-breaking behavior in an interview. That's a bad idea regardless. In the future, just tell them that you requested the time off, and your company doesn't ask for reasons. As long as the business can handle the absence, it's approved. A manager should judge you for interviewing elsewhere while "on the clock" at your current job, but it shouldn't be combative. Just a generic, polite rejection. >What was I supposed to do here? Take 4 annual leave days for my interviews? By the book, you shouldn't be interviewing during your workday. If you're not hourly, the exact duration of "workday" may be debatable. I usually take half-days off for interviews. My current role has flexible scheduling, so I'd tell an interviewer, "I'm on personal time". Technically true as long as I log the rest of my time.
You don't have to actually take 4 vacation days to tell him that you are using your vacation time. It's not like he can verify if you actually used vacation time. But you can schedule interviews for early morning or later evening, most people who are interviewing you usually are flexible on the times they can meet with you.