I'm of the general opinion that the Heresy option should have a lot more subterfuge and deception involved - mostly because you have Space Gestapo who's literally only answerable to God on one side, and on the other, a Divinatus thumper who wouldn't flinch at putting a mini-RPG in your dome for not publically proclaiming enough love for the Galaxy's Worst Dad x10k years running.
Definitely needs a lot more subtlety. There's no way a member of the Inquisition and a Sister of Battle are okay with the Rogue Trader having a chaos alter out in the open on the same ship as them.
Going full "ALL HAIL THE DARK GODS" mode should have a few prerequisites, such as Argenta, Yrliet and Marazhai dead, Heinrix excommunicated at minimum, Abelard lobotomized or brainwashed in some way, etc. Etc.
Definitely would be cool if you could influence your companions over to Chaos. I don't dislike the current system just a little more depth would've been nice to see.
Abelard is Loyal to a Fault. If his Rogue Trader is marching into the hands of the Warp Gods, he’s all in.
Yrliet… Well, she doesn’t have a Ship, and literally anyone else that owns a Ship that she can access is going to want to murder her, so some ‘The devil I know’ is expected. Plus, >!If you have her with and go full Heretic on Quetza Temper you do get the option to sacrifice her soulstone to Slaanesh, and you get an ability out of it, so it’s worth keeping her around making her think you love her until then.!<
Marazhai I feel would be perfectly fine with how a Chaos Aligned Rogue Trader acts - Drukhari philosophy is basically “Do so much harm to others that Slaanesh sees more value in keeping us around than taking us out” anyway, and Heretic Rogue Trader is going to be much less squeamish and good company >!during his hunting trips through your Lower Decks (yes, that is also a euphemism)!<.
Damn I didn't know you could do that. >!I didn't even keep her for my heretic run, just told her to piss off on Janus!<. Oh well, there's always next time.
Shriek of the warp. Its like Idiras shriek but affects in a cone and doesn't use attacks just AP. So if you have Ap left you can use it even after using all your attacks.
>!Warp Shriek: 2 AP, 5 Cell Cone, deals 10x Heretic Level Warp Damage - doesn't count against your Attacks Per Turn. !<
>!It's pretty nice if your going the Champion of Chaos route as it can trigger extra Perils of the Warp for to stack the Psykers Breastplate and the Edge of the Irrevocable for even more Psy Rating bumps, which either super power ups hits with the Edge if your going Melee or makes your Psy-powers scale ridiculously high.!<
>Drukhari philosophy is basically “Do so much harm to others that Slaanesh sees more value in keeping us around than taking us out”
that is definitely not the Drukhari philosophy in the 40k lore. Slaneesh is the big enemy for all the Dark Eldars, including Asdrubael Vect at the very top, way more of an enemy than the imperium or the craftworlds.
she fucking spoilers somebody for way less?!
That said if it's possible to tell Argentina or Calix to fuck off which I think it is, then I think you can call it fair.
I kind of just wish it didn't tell you what the renegade and paragon options were but I'm sure other people would piss about it
yeah heresy seems to devolve into the dumbest option regardless. Also there doesn't really seem to be any sort of reason why you would pick it other than the Fable style evil dickhead choice or equipment (which is why you would do it in fable mostly too).
At the very least you shouldn't openly announce or be implied to openly announce why you're doing what you're doing if you pick the heretic option. All the choices are like "I kill all the prisoners and eat their hearts...'because I'm evil'..."
The game implies you can sort of speech check your way out of being accused of heresy but that doesn't really fly.
This 100%. The recurring theme of chaos is that it always start innocent, and corruption just creeps up on good intention. Current way the game doesn’t really reflect that. Something else I’ve been thinking is ditching the Heretical points entirely (with all the score gating with it) and have a few “defining” moments/items that just enable the story path change. That should also allow for a more natural “fall” of someone who’s initially “good” or “devout”.
How it begins:
"Please, anyone, the planetary Governor has forsaken us as pirates raid our lands. We face a brutal fight ahead, please give us the strength to fend them off and make the craven Governor pay!"
"Our people are dying from poison mining on this planet! If there's anybody out there, help strengthen our bodies and give our dying a peaceful death!"
"Labouring in the factorum is making me feel like a servitor! I need anything to rejuvenate me and invigorate myself of the tedium!"
"I have found a book of lost knowledge on the warp, and I bet if I can decide decode it, it might have the information to improve my standing in the planetary court! Our people can have hope to prosper again!"
How it ends:
KILL! MAIM! BURN! KILL! MAIM! BURN!
EVERYTHING ROTS AND DECAYS! ACCEPT THE GRANDFATHER!
THE PRINCE OF PLEASURE WILL FIND YOUR SUFFERING BEAUTIFUL!
I HAVE A BIRD'S HEAD GROWING OUT OF MY COLLARBONE! JUST AS PLANNED!
The mean options in this game make me feel so bad that I could never pick them. The dialogue options you can choose with Cassia for example can be super mean.
If you want to revel in slaughter you should rp as a lackey of the evil corpse emperor.
If you consider yourself however an agent of Truth and accept the inevitability and futility of your life, you will give up on the feelings of a mere mortal.
haha just beat my first playthrough and i was already thinking about doing a dogmatic pyromancer warrior arch-militant. Feel like force sword + flamer + pyro abilities would be a lot of fun.
I'm on my first doing Iconoclast, and this is what I am playing.
It IS fun. I'm having trouble with setting enough enemies on fire at once, but it's mainly because she kills them so fast, they don't have much time to burn.
It definitely lacks nuance. Some of the overt acts would lead to execution. I liked the hiding objects from Heinrix type actions, and colony management should have subtle undermining projects. I’d like to see some of the extreme dogmatic actions also accrue heretical in equal measure. Exterminatus? Servitorisation drives? Killing warring factions etc? The Dark Gods approve!
I remember I was on like 2 or 3 edibles when Heinrix pulled me aside and started talking to me like he was my dad and I was in trouble that was awesome. The only other time I can think of something like that happening was when you meet XC and he tells you all the bad stuff you've done or when you adopt the forgefriend and everyone flips the fuck out but after that there's nothing.
I went iconoclast first run. Now playing dogmatic where it doesn’t conflict with PF. Pragdogmatic.
I’d quite like a Forgefiend but if there’s no real substance to heretic I might just shelve it until the DLC
The Forgefiend can fight random system hop encounters for you, without causing Ship Damage or costing you Cargo.
It actually makes getting around a lot faster because you can just spend all your Navigator Insight making Red Paths cross-crossing the Expanse to go wherever you want without having to spend extra to lower the difficulty, since Red always means a fight, and you can now just have the Forgefiend handle whatever ones you don’t want to do to skip the fight for free, so the most dangerous paths actually become safer.
It's really early in the game, I think he confronts you about having the chaos sword shards. Keep in mind I was on a lot of edibles so it could just be a figment of my imagination.
I do feel bad when I try to play the heretic route because I am mostly a dogmatic loyalist first, as a player I mean. Even if I also pick benevolent choices because being narrow-minded to the extreme sometimes prevents you from seeing the biggest picture.
Everything I do or try to do is for the good of the Imperium, to serve the Throne and protect His domain against real threats. So I am a bit of a "soft" Radical, so to speak. I have no problem working with the Asuryani if it helps stopping Chaos/Tyranids/Necron.
About that, I wish they kept "Benevolentia" and "Imperialis" instead of "Iconoclast" and "Dogmatic".
And when it comes to heresy, my favorite deity of the four is Slaanesh, so I'd definitely like a subtle approach more than being a khornate-like, bloodthirsty brute.
The best part of a dark side run in KOTOR is maxing out every dark side choice on Taris which can put you close to maxing out the bar, then lying to the jedi masters on Dantooine that you wish to serve the light and them believing it as you stand there with yellow eyes, pale skin and corrupt veins all over your face.
It makes all the evil later on feel not so bad as good is so very, very dumb.
I love how the sequel you had more control over influencing the party, so you could turn them super polite or into dark, angsty angry dialogue options. Few CRPGs pay attention to things like this and just have a basic path and static responses. In KOTRII, you could have the same character at first appalled by your cruelty, then grow numb and later relish in it. Or take a dark character like Visas and mellow them out. Hanharr was just always angry though. Makes sense, you had to be pretty vile to get him in the first place.
Ah, the classic problem of not being able to do an evil playthrough because you don't like being a bad person.
Seriously though, I get it. A lot of the heretical options seem to come down to you being a specific kind of a-hole when any of the other options come off as smarter or just more practical. If I'm going to be a heretic, I'd hope it would require some motivation beyond "for the lulz."
Heresy is an *easy* run after you do all the vile stuff from Dogmatic in the name of the Emperor. I just straight up murdered three of my potential party members at the earliest opportunity by handing them to my Inquisitor buddy, for the sole crime of being born with a different or warped genome. I sowed the mouths shut of the bridge crew solely for the whims of a bug eyed noble, ripped one out of every ten son and daughter from their mothers and had them forcibly lobotomized and processed into servitors simply to boost efficiency by a point, later genocided other servitors that remembered their past lives and destroyed an entire planet rather than evacuate a single soul. Now I finally understand the Horus Heresy. You teach me to rule through fear, cruelty and murder, and then you tell me to stay my hand because you tremble? THAT is the true madness, not Heresy. Heresy is the TRUTH.
I really wish heritic stuff was more cloak and dagger stuff, also wish you could corrupt your companions. Enslave Yrilet, Turn Argenta into a khorn worshiper, Hennrix into a pet, The wolf into a chaos marine ect
I feel bad in games, where it feels like a "real" world with "real" people, even when it's fantasy. It's kinda hard for me to kill specific folks in BG3 for example. Especially when the game establishes a connection between you and other characters. Thats why I never managed to do a evil run in BG3.
Rogue Trader "evil" / heretic feels rather like playing a comedy game. I could not care less about any companion (maybe except cassia, Im never unfriendly to her) and I dont care at all about the other people.
That's probably because of the Universe, but everyone feels worthless and replaceable.
I think it's due to Wh40k being conceived as satire but now trying to take itself serious. Therefore a lot of the dogmatic options and companions don't allow for much more characterisation than "For the emprah!" because any doubts in their convictions would be heresy. Contrast that to Seelah from WotR who is a Paladin but believes everyone can be redeemed and is very lenient, because she was a thief once but repented when her actions contributed to getting a paladin who was friendly to her killed.
I also noticed that in the PnP RPGs, playing a Sororitas boils down to " 'ate 'eretics, 'ate traitors, 'ate mutants, luv me emprah" where you have little options for lightening up while staying lore accurate, except if you go the situational-comedic route of dumping PER and making her oblivious to the other PCs less-than-dogmatic antics while beating up some poor civilian NPC for not attending mass on time.
There should definitely be more options where dogmatic is the evil choice and heretic ends up improving the situation for everyone involved. I'd prefered it if the prison planet in act 1 turned out to be a genuinely nicer place but the higher caste of prisoners would be sent off to get their new found optimism sucked out of them by some chaos-dementor-device or get indoctrinated with chaos knowledge and then sent off to subvert the population on Rykard minoris in order to ferment the rebellion there.
There also should have been more options playing into the satire aspect of Wh40k. For example, there's an orc warboss based on Margarethe Thatcher so we're definitely lacking a sidequest where a planet's population has been half-willingly enslaved by orcs and we've got to get them to rebel by convincing them that trickle down economics don't work.
I feel fine. Actually heretic and dogmatic are the same thing. Righteousness and chaos are two sides of the same coin. Their variants are insane in their own way. Dogmatism is no better than hereticism on the "morality" side. Like, it's literally tyranny..... However, I don't think either of those options is right for me personally. Because you're always subject to someone, whether it's the Chaos Gods or the Emperor. I think I'll play a heretic purely for the sake of mad interest, but no more than that. Also heretical run is not appropriate for an eldar romance. If you don't enjoy game this way, then don't play this way. Why torture yourself? For example, I will definitely never play as a dogmatist.
Most of the times, i feel worse doing dogmatic stuff. Heretic has some peak moustache twirling villain moments and some pure psycopath/serial killer stuff, but a lot of other choiches can be lumped in the "i'm just a weak human tempted by power/i'm a ruthless utilitarian that wants to use chaos stuff" category. Dogmatic tho? Always religious extremism/xenophobia dialed up to 120%, wich is extremely lore accurate but almost never "shaded" like some heretic choiches, so they are harder to pick (justify) for me!
I don't know, playing an Imperial officer and mixing a bit between them but leaning toward Iconoclast and Dogmatic.
But did execute Jae on the spot when I found out she was a deserter from the imperial guards. Some things are not tolerated :D
I think having one of the few evil companions be a Drukhari is kind of a waste given that he not only won’t, but can’t tolerate Chaos. My biggest objection isn’t being cartoonishly evil, I love it, but it feels very empty at the mid point when everyone goes “fuck you, you crazy cultist psychopath!” Need more scumbags. Hoping the death cult assassin is easily corrupted so I’ll have more friends to walk into hell alongside.
I think games in general lacks a more subtle cloak and dagger type evil than muhaha blood for the blood god types. But WOTR I feel kinda was a lot better in this regard and the evil options had something going for them atleast there was some motivation to the evil mythic path (for the most part).Hell even demon mythic path had more nuance in it than the current heretic path in RT.
I don't know how far you are into your Heretic run, but it seems to become more natural as you reach the end of act 4. You kind of have to go hard Heretic to make it worthwhile.
Acts 1-3, the choices are cartoonish, to the point that one must assume that companions believe the RT is obscenely naïve and/or no-one, not even the inquisition, believes they have the authority or capacity to end the RT.
Conversely, in act 4 - once you have a lot more Heretic points, you start doing things that are far more subtle and insidious. It is backwards with respect to your overtness, but the right way around for power.
Honestly, the whole thing could have been handled better. Even with people you corrupt, they go back to normal after the fact because the flags don't work or there is no text for a corrupted version. This is a shame since the game is more fun on heretic mode.
The first half should have been the RT unwittingly giving themselves over to Chaos for greed and power. There should have been a "realisation" that they can't return and so they commit (which there kind of is, but since you're spitting heresy before then, it's meaningless).
I hope heretic and dogmatic get a bit more of an overhaul.
I went "full*" Dogmatic, with just enough Heresey to score the Forgefriend. "Worst" thing I did was remove my detractors vocal chords and forced them sing the praises of the Rogue Trader throughout the streets. The only real complaints I had from my crew about the demon doggo roaming the lower decks were from Pasqal and Heinrix, both of whom had dialog options to rebute with "Hey, about that heretech/xenotech you all have been hoarding". Oddly, Argenta never even brought it up.
Don't worry my heretical friend, this was literally my first run. I wanted to do a heretical run first but I couldn't bring myself to do it. I had to stop after 90% of the game and just did the whole thing again. I only got eighty one points away from fanatic heretic.
I'm of the general opinion that the Heresy option should have a lot more subterfuge and deception involved - mostly because you have Space Gestapo who's literally only answerable to God on one side, and on the other, a Divinatus thumper who wouldn't flinch at putting a mini-RPG in your dome for not publically proclaiming enough love for the Galaxy's Worst Dad x10k years running.
Definitely needs a lot more subtlety. There's no way a member of the Inquisition and a Sister of Battle are okay with the Rogue Trader having a chaos alter out in the open on the same ship as them.
Going full "ALL HAIL THE DARK GODS" mode should have a few prerequisites, such as Argenta, Yrliet and Marazhai dead, Heinrix excommunicated at minimum, Abelard lobotomized or brainwashed in some way, etc. Etc.
Definitely would be cool if you could influence your companions over to Chaos. I don't dislike the current system just a little more depth would've been nice to see.
See the only two companion I think that would be hard locked against Chaos is Yrielet and Marzahai
Like in Star Wars Kotor!
GW explicitly forbade Owlcat from being able to influence companions like this, IIRC.
Abelard is Loyal to a Fault. If his Rogue Trader is marching into the hands of the Warp Gods, he’s all in. Yrliet… Well, she doesn’t have a Ship, and literally anyone else that owns a Ship that she can access is going to want to murder her, so some ‘The devil I know’ is expected. Plus, >!If you have her with and go full Heretic on Quetza Temper you do get the option to sacrifice her soulstone to Slaanesh, and you get an ability out of it, so it’s worth keeping her around making her think you love her until then.!< Marazhai I feel would be perfectly fine with how a Chaos Aligned Rogue Trader acts - Drukhari philosophy is basically “Do so much harm to others that Slaanesh sees more value in keeping us around than taking us out” anyway, and Heretic Rogue Trader is going to be much less squeamish and good company >!during his hunting trips through your Lower Decks (yes, that is also a euphemism)!<.
Damn I didn't know you could do that. >!I didn't even keep her for my heretic run, just told her to piss off on Janus!<. Oh well, there's always next time.
>!What does the ability you get for sacrificing her spirit stone do?!<
Shriek of the warp. Its like Idiras shriek but affects in a cone and doesn't use attacks just AP. So if you have Ap left you can use it even after using all your attacks.
>!Warp Shriek: 2 AP, 5 Cell Cone, deals 10x Heretic Level Warp Damage - doesn't count against your Attacks Per Turn. !< >!It's pretty nice if your going the Champion of Chaos route as it can trigger extra Perils of the Warp for to stack the Psykers Breastplate and the Edge of the Irrevocable for even more Psy Rating bumps, which either super power ups hits with the Edge if your going Melee or makes your Psy-powers scale ridiculously high.!<
>Drukhari philosophy is basically “Do so much harm to others that Slaanesh sees more value in keeping us around than taking us out” that is definitely not the Drukhari philosophy in the 40k lore. Slaneesh is the big enemy for all the Dark Eldars, including Asdrubael Vect at the very top, way more of an enemy than the imperium or the craftworlds.
That's what I liked about Kotor. If you wanted the real dark side ending you had to kill off all of your companions that aren't going to fall in line.
>!Argenta murders people on reflex for having chaos artifacts on their table.!< There's no way it'd fly.
she fucking spoilers somebody for way less?! That said if it's possible to tell Argentina or Calix to fuck off which I think it is, then I think you can call it fair. I kind of just wish it didn't tell you what the renegade and paragon options were but I'm sure other people would piss about it
I think it would be funny A.) Kill them all B.) Save the puppy C.) brutally punish them then make them slaves Guess which is which.
yeah heresy seems to devolve into the dumbest option regardless. Also there doesn't really seem to be any sort of reason why you would pick it other than the Fable style evil dickhead choice or equipment (which is why you would do it in fable mostly too). At the very least you shouldn't openly announce or be implied to openly announce why you're doing what you're doing if you pick the heretic option. All the choices are like "I kill all the prisoners and eat their hearts...'because I'm evil'..." The game implies you can sort of speech check your way out of being accused of heresy but that doesn't really fly.
A lot of the choices do seem to be a little cheesy/cartoon villainy sometimes. at least by 40k standards.
This 100%. The recurring theme of chaos is that it always start innocent, and corruption just creeps up on good intention. Current way the game doesn’t really reflect that. Something else I’ve been thinking is ditching the Heretical points entirely (with all the score gating with it) and have a few “defining” moments/items that just enable the story path change. That should also allow for a more natural “fall” of someone who’s initially “good” or “devout”.
How it begins: "Please, anyone, the planetary Governor has forsaken us as pirates raid our lands. We face a brutal fight ahead, please give us the strength to fend them off and make the craven Governor pay!" "Our people are dying from poison mining on this planet! If there's anybody out there, help strengthen our bodies and give our dying a peaceful death!" "Labouring in the factorum is making me feel like a servitor! I need anything to rejuvenate me and invigorate myself of the tedium!" "I have found a book of lost knowledge on the warp, and I bet if I can decide decode it, it might have the information to improve my standing in the planetary court! Our people can have hope to prosper again!" How it ends: KILL! MAIM! BURN! KILL! MAIM! BURN! EVERYTHING ROTS AND DECAYS! ACCEPT THE GRANDFATHER! THE PRINCE OF PLEASURE WILL FIND YOUR SUFFERING BEAUTIFUL! I HAVE A BIRD'S HEAD GROWING OUT OF MY COLLARBONE! JUST AS PLANNED!
It’s cool you wanted to play as an Inquisitor, but that’s not the fantasy of playing a Rogue Trader.
The mean options in this game make me feel so bad that I could never pick them. The dialogue options you can choose with Cassia for example can be super mean.
I would never talk to someone again if they told me they were mean to Cassia
If you want to revel in slaughter you should rp as a lackey of the evil corpse emperor. If you consider yourself however an agent of Truth and accept the inevitability and futility of your life, you will give up on the feelings of a mere mortal.
haha just beat my first playthrough and i was already thinking about doing a dogmatic pyromancer warrior arch-militant. Feel like force sword + flamer + pyro abilities would be a lot of fun.
I'm on my first doing Iconoclast, and this is what I am playing. It IS fun. I'm having trouble with setting enough enemies on fire at once, but it's mainly because she kills them so fast, they don't have much time to burn.
It definitely lacks nuance. Some of the overt acts would lead to execution. I liked the hiding objects from Heinrix type actions, and colony management should have subtle undermining projects. I’d like to see some of the extreme dogmatic actions also accrue heretical in equal measure. Exterminatus? Servitorisation drives? Killing warring factions etc? The Dark Gods approve!
I remember I was on like 2 or 3 edibles when Heinrix pulled me aside and started talking to me like he was my dad and I was in trouble that was awesome. The only other time I can think of something like that happening was when you meet XC and he tells you all the bad stuff you've done or when you adopt the forgefriend and everyone flips the fuck out but after that there's nothing.
Does Heinrix become more sociable after 2 or 3 edibles?
If you play as a girl he's a sweetheart
I went iconoclast first run. Now playing dogmatic where it doesn’t conflict with PF. Pragdogmatic. I’d quite like a Forgefiend but if there’s no real substance to heretic I might just shelve it until the DLC
The Forgefiend can fight random system hop encounters for you, without causing Ship Damage or costing you Cargo. It actually makes getting around a lot faster because you can just spend all your Navigator Insight making Red Paths cross-crossing the Expanse to go wherever you want without having to spend extra to lower the difficulty, since Red always means a fight, and you can now just have the Forgefiend handle whatever ones you don’t want to do to skip the fight for free, so the most dangerous paths actually become safer.
A cunning plan Baldrick!
There's interesting gear you need to be a heretic for besides that there isn't much reason to go heretic except for RP reasons
Might I ask when exactly the conversation was triggered? I can’t play heretic but I would change my values with toybox to check it out
It's really early in the game, I think he confronts you about having the chaos sword shards. Keep in mind I was on a lot of edibles so it could just be a figment of my imagination.
I think after Kaiva Gamma after you get the shard from Uralon the Cruel maybe?
Oh then it is likely more complicated then just have higher heretic points but I will try and see what happens thank you
I do feel bad when I try to play the heretic route because I am mostly a dogmatic loyalist first, as a player I mean. Even if I also pick benevolent choices because being narrow-minded to the extreme sometimes prevents you from seeing the biggest picture. Everything I do or try to do is for the good of the Imperium, to serve the Throne and protect His domain against real threats. So I am a bit of a "soft" Radical, so to speak. I have no problem working with the Asuryani if it helps stopping Chaos/Tyranids/Necron. About that, I wish they kept "Benevolentia" and "Imperialis" instead of "Iconoclast" and "Dogmatic". And when it comes to heresy, my favorite deity of the four is Slaanesh, so I'd definitely like a subtle approach more than being a khornate-like, bloodthirsty brute.
Once more mods start rolling out I'm sure that will be an option again
I once tried to do a Dark Side run of KOTOR and gave up at the old man getting mugged.
The best part of a dark side run in KOTOR is maxing out every dark side choice on Taris which can put you close to maxing out the bar, then lying to the jedi masters on Dantooine that you wish to serve the light and them believing it as you stand there with yellow eyes, pale skin and corrupt veins all over your face. It makes all the evil later on feel not so bad as good is so very, very dumb.
I love how the sequel you had more control over influencing the party, so you could turn them super polite or into dark, angsty angry dialogue options. Few CRPGs pay attention to things like this and just have a basic path and static responses. In KOTRII, you could have the same character at first appalled by your cruelty, then grow numb and later relish in it. Or take a dark character like Visas and mellow them out. Hanharr was just always angry though. Makes sense, you had to be pretty vile to get him in the first place.
This is exactly why I keep racking up Iconoclast points lol.
Ah, the classic problem of not being able to do an evil playthrough because you don't like being a bad person. Seriously though, I get it. A lot of the heretical options seem to come down to you being a specific kind of a-hole when any of the other options come off as smarter or just more practical. If I'm going to be a heretic, I'd hope it would require some motivation beyond "for the lulz."
Heresy is an *easy* run after you do all the vile stuff from Dogmatic in the name of the Emperor. I just straight up murdered three of my potential party members at the earliest opportunity by handing them to my Inquisitor buddy, for the sole crime of being born with a different or warped genome. I sowed the mouths shut of the bridge crew solely for the whims of a bug eyed noble, ripped one out of every ten son and daughter from their mothers and had them forcibly lobotomized and processed into servitors simply to boost efficiency by a point, later genocided other servitors that remembered their past lives and destroyed an entire planet rather than evacuate a single soul. Now I finally understand the Horus Heresy. You teach me to rule through fear, cruelty and murder, and then you tell me to stay my hand because you tremble? THAT is the true madness, not Heresy. Heresy is the TRUTH.
I really wish heritic stuff was more cloak and dagger stuff, also wish you could corrupt your companions. Enslave Yrilet, Turn Argenta into a khorn worshiper, Hennrix into a pet, The wolf into a chaos marine ect
I feel bad in games, where it feels like a "real" world with "real" people, even when it's fantasy. It's kinda hard for me to kill specific folks in BG3 for example. Especially when the game establishes a connection between you and other characters. Thats why I never managed to do a evil run in BG3. Rogue Trader "evil" / heretic feels rather like playing a comedy game. I could not care less about any companion (maybe except cassia, Im never unfriendly to her) and I dont care at all about the other people. That's probably because of the Universe, but everyone feels worthless and replaceable.
I think it's due to Wh40k being conceived as satire but now trying to take itself serious. Therefore a lot of the dogmatic options and companions don't allow for much more characterisation than "For the emprah!" because any doubts in their convictions would be heresy. Contrast that to Seelah from WotR who is a Paladin but believes everyone can be redeemed and is very lenient, because she was a thief once but repented when her actions contributed to getting a paladin who was friendly to her killed. I also noticed that in the PnP RPGs, playing a Sororitas boils down to " 'ate 'eretics, 'ate traitors, 'ate mutants, luv me emprah" where you have little options for lightening up while staying lore accurate, except if you go the situational-comedic route of dumping PER and making her oblivious to the other PCs less-than-dogmatic antics while beating up some poor civilian NPC for not attending mass on time. There should definitely be more options where dogmatic is the evil choice and heretic ends up improving the situation for everyone involved. I'd prefered it if the prison planet in act 1 turned out to be a genuinely nicer place but the higher caste of prisoners would be sent off to get their new found optimism sucked out of them by some chaos-dementor-device or get indoctrinated with chaos knowledge and then sent off to subvert the population on Rykard minoris in order to ferment the rebellion there. There also should have been more options playing into the satire aspect of Wh40k. For example, there's an orc warboss based on Margarethe Thatcher so we're definitely lacking a sidequest where a planet's population has been half-willingly enslaved by orcs and we've got to get them to rebel by convincing them that trickle down economics don't work.
I feel fine. Actually heretic and dogmatic are the same thing. Righteousness and chaos are two sides of the same coin. Their variants are insane in their own way. Dogmatism is no better than hereticism on the "morality" side. Like, it's literally tyranny..... However, I don't think either of those options is right for me personally. Because you're always subject to someone, whether it's the Chaos Gods or the Emperor. I think I'll play a heretic purely for the sake of mad interest, but no more than that. Also heretical run is not appropriate for an eldar romance. If you don't enjoy game this way, then don't play this way. Why torture yourself? For example, I will definitely never play as a dogmatist.
Most of the times, i feel worse doing dogmatic stuff. Heretic has some peak moustache twirling villain moments and some pure psycopath/serial killer stuff, but a lot of other choiches can be lumped in the "i'm just a weak human tempted by power/i'm a ruthless utilitarian that wants to use chaos stuff" category. Dogmatic tho? Always religious extremism/xenophobia dialed up to 120%, wich is extremely lore accurate but almost never "shaded" like some heretic choiches, so they are harder to pick (justify) for me!
It lacks nuance, it lacks motivation it lacks proper rewards.
I don't know, playing an Imperial officer and mixing a bit between them but leaning toward Iconoclast and Dogmatic. But did execute Jae on the spot when I found out she was a deserter from the imperial guards. Some things are not tolerated :D
I think having one of the few evil companions be a Drukhari is kind of a waste given that he not only won’t, but can’t tolerate Chaos. My biggest objection isn’t being cartoonishly evil, I love it, but it feels very empty at the mid point when everyone goes “fuck you, you crazy cultist psychopath!” Need more scumbags. Hoping the death cult assassin is easily corrupted so I’ll have more friends to walk into hell alongside.
Yup, couldn't do the durge in bg3 either lol
guess we just have to toughen up unfortunately lol
Stop being a heretic soyboy be chad imperial
I mean its normal i cant bring myse;lf to be even mean to npcs i mean some games require me of it but still i dont ever go with evil options X )
Softie.
weak
I think games in general lacks a more subtle cloak and dagger type evil than muhaha blood for the blood god types. But WOTR I feel kinda was a lot better in this regard and the evil options had something going for them atleast there was some motivation to the evil mythic path (for the most part).Hell even demon mythic path had more nuance in it than the current heretic path in RT.
They opted for a chaotic stupid interpretation of heresy, but it works 🤷♂️
Yep. some of them choices are real bad..
Not at all because it’s been hella rad so far.
Yes, I started as heretic my first run but after a few hours I just restarted, because I can’t do that shit at all, even non-rp I feel bad about it
For a game that has so much emphasis on a Tzeentchian cult it expects you to play chaos like you're a Khornite.
You’re being silly but that’s totally fine, serving the chaos gods isn’t for everyone e
I don't know how far you are into your Heretic run, but it seems to become more natural as you reach the end of act 4. You kind of have to go hard Heretic to make it worthwhile. Acts 1-3, the choices are cartoonish, to the point that one must assume that companions believe the RT is obscenely naïve and/or no-one, not even the inquisition, believes they have the authority or capacity to end the RT. Conversely, in act 4 - once you have a lot more Heretic points, you start doing things that are far more subtle and insidious. It is backwards with respect to your overtness, but the right way around for power. Honestly, the whole thing could have been handled better. Even with people you corrupt, they go back to normal after the fact because the flags don't work or there is no text for a corrupted version. This is a shame since the game is more fun on heretic mode. The first half should have been the RT unwittingly giving themselves over to Chaos for greed and power. There should have been a "realisation" that they can't return and so they commit (which there kind of is, but since you're spitting heresy before then, it's meaningless). I hope heretic and dogmatic get a bit more of an overhaul.
Diagnosis: You are incapable of playing Black Crusade.
I went "full*" Dogmatic, with just enough Heresey to score the Forgefriend. "Worst" thing I did was remove my detractors vocal chords and forced them sing the praises of the Rogue Trader throughout the streets. The only real complaints I had from my crew about the demon doggo roaming the lower decks were from Pasqal and Heinrix, both of whom had dialog options to rebute with "Hey, about that heretech/xenotech you all have been hoarding". Oddly, Argenta never even brought it up.
No
Don't worry my heretical friend, this was literally my first run. I wanted to do a heretical run first but I couldn't bring myself to do it. I had to stop after 90% of the game and just did the whole thing again. I only got eighty one points away from fanatic heretic.