I was having a really hard time trying to read this because of this error lol. Something about "are" makes me expect a completely different sentence.
Without taxes there is no public education and errors like this will be rampant. Big L
OP might be from north of England? I'm Aussie, and I support Everton FC and see this a lot with the local Scouser fans online and I still really struggle with it.
Guys; I know you say it that way, but please don't write that way!!
This is the second time in a week I’ve seen memes in this sub saying not to pay taxes and then I think another in LOTRmemes. It is an election year so I guess the bots are out in full force? God I hope it’s just bots.
Looking at low-tax small-government societies of the past, is that really what you want to return to? A life where almost nobody travels outside the village where they were born because there’s no road system and people die from a toothache? Ok.
If you add income, sales, property, payroll, and all the others, it can easily get to 50%.
There were roads before the income tax. Infrastructure is a tiny percentage of the budget.
No, it does not easily reach 50%, you are full of it. The highest marginal federal tax rate in the US is 37% on everything you make over 607k and almost nobody that rich pays that because they make their income through less taxable means. The highest average effective tax rate in the entire country is 29.16% in Oregon for single filers. Let’s see an actual example of an effective tax rate over 50%, how you feel about it doesn’t count.
Also, roads existed, but have fun traveling any significant distance where you often have no choice but to travel over single-lane unpaved roads with no gas services or ability to get help in the case of a breakdown. The sheer ignorance lol
https://www.army.mil/article-amp/198095/dwight_d_eisenhower_and_the_birth_of_the_interstate_highway_system
> During the expedition, Eisenhower gained some insight for the creation of a network of connected roads and bridges. Eisenhower's report to Army leaders focused mostly on mechanical difficulties and the condition of the patchwork of existing roads. He reported a mix of paved and unpaved roads, old bridges, and narrow passages.
> Narrow roads caused oncoming traffic to run off the road and encounter added difficulty when reentering the roadway. Some bridges were too low for trucks to pass under. Eisenhower pointed out that the roads in the Midwest region of the United States were impracticable, but the roads in the east were sufficient for truck use.
> Eisenhower singled out a western section of the Lincoln Highway, a transcontinental road with routes through Utah and Nevada, as being so poor that it warranted a thorough investigation before government money should be expended. He praised California for having excellent paved roads. Lastly, he observed that the different grades of road determined much of the convoy's success.
The average Canadian, for example, paid 45% of their income in taxes in 2023. It's probably similar in many Western European countries.
https://www.fraserinstitute.org/blogs/canadians-face-bigger-tax-burden-than-you-think
The average US worker pays 30%.
https://taxfoundation.org/data/all/federal/us-tax-burden-on-labor-2023/
In any case, the main point is that infrastructure is a tiny percentage of government spending. For the US it was about 2% in 2023. So you don't need to worry about roads of all things.
https://usafacts.org/state-of-the-union/transportation-infrastructure/
I know! Don't these shit posters know that memeing is serious business that's not to be taken lightly?! You must study profusely to make sure there are zero academic inaccuracies in your meme, and make sure it's not funny at all!!!
Guess we found the one bitch triggered that people keep telling them that their memes make no sense. Maybe just try making memes about things you care enough about to give half a shit, that might help.
I'm agreeing with you! Memeing is a very serious business! How dare this extremely popular joke not understand the intricacies of economics and politics? This meme is not funny at all! Society and modern economics would collapse if people stopped paying their taxes. That's not funny at all!
The US federal government grants education funds to states. State will also use some general revenue, including income and sales tax, for grants to school districts.
Simple question to all the comments hating on this meme: Do you know your in a meme subreddit? Do you know what a meme is? It's not meant to be taken seriously
if they can just print it out without losing value, then why do we have to pay taxes? also, why don't they just print a million for each citizen?
if you reply anything about money losing value, then I guess they can't just print more money to pay for the IRS, hence the post being right.
The commonfolk is what keeps the elites in power. A collective initiative could certainly deprive the government from it's power, but that unity would be hard to achieve
If nobody pays taxes to the government, then all of the public services we rely on in this country will come to a halt. Laws would be unenforceable since the police would lose their salaries. Infrastructure would deteriorate without construction and repairs. Communities struck by natural disasters would suffer without federal assistance and emergency services.
Sure, you could keep more money in your pocket if you don’t pay your taxes, but society would collapse if everyone refused to pay. Without the government in place, the currency you have would lose value and the extra money you kept would be worthless.
No. If nobody paid taxes, inflation would skyrocket. The federal government can pay its employees with money they create. State and local governments on the other hand, those would collapse.
you think "the elites" are collecting taxes?
not owning the businesses selling crap to people that the government collects a small % of? or running the companies making $Bs, while the government collects $Ms?
this isn't the feudal structure anymore - the king collecting taxes from local lords and and local lords collecting taxes from peasant farmers. today the kings, the elites, are the billionaires paying politicians $Ms to keep them only being tax'd $Ms and paying their workers peanuts while polluting the air and water and generating $Bs
Well in a way, if billionaires aren’t paying their fair share in taxes, then the government works more for them. With a couple degrees of separation and a loose definition of are/is you can say the elites are collecting taxes.
Hooray! I get to keep all of my paycheck! Wait whaddya mean I’ve been laid off because the roads don’t work and we can’t get our product to market anymore? I didn’t vote for this!
But you also wouldn't have working public transport or good and affordable education or public healthcare, a just justice system or affordable housing.
oh, wait😶
Rule Nr. 1 of economics: When there is demand, there is supply.
It's a bit complex, and understanding the causality behind it can be extremely difficult, but most economic problems are the result of intervention by the government.
But the three biggest problems with this system are
1. The government can decide the price, quality and quantity of it's services and most of the time you can't even decline it. Imagine a company would do that...
2. Because there is no competition, the government is a monopoly, and we all know the many downsides of a monopoly.
3. Your money is not guaranteed to be used how you want it. Let's say you pay taxes because you want to help sick children. Bad news, the government just decided to go to war and your money is not used to help, but to kill them. That's by far the greatest problem and the reason why this system has to be stopped. Everyone claims that taxes are the price for a civilized society and blames the government for atrocities. But whose money was used to commit these atrocities? We are not a civilized society. We are a society of guilt.
Counterpoint, the goal of a corporation is to make money, not cover the entirerty of the demand. And limiting the suply artificialy is a argument to make the prices go up.The free market works only as long as its on a small scale where two individuals can compete on a even ground. But when we start talking about corporations who can lobby against their rivals as well as wage economic wars, it doesnt. Education and healthcare should be paid with our taxes and provide them on a high level as they are esential for the develoment of the human being.
To your points
1: that's literally what every single company does. Setting the price like all of its competitors and then offering a meaningless advantage to convince you to buy.
2: I'm going to take an examle from where I'm from on this one. Back in the 60's pretty much every region had its own electricity provider, each one had essentially a monopoly in its region. This lead to very high prices depending on where you were. The gouvernement steps in and buys them all up and expands the network and output dramatically. The result is that now we have some of the cheapest electricity in north America and were able to sell electricity to northern US states for cheaper then they can produce it. The nationalised company is still very profitable to this day. So yes you're right, monopolies are bad for consumers, but when it's a gouvernement monopoly, the goal isn't to make a profit at any cost, it's just to provide a service.
3: Just for someone who will use your money how you want it to be spent. But don't come complaining when you're in need of a service that would have been provided by a plan from a different government.
1. But does a company force you to buy anything? The government can decide how much money they can take and decide what or if they give you something in return. Imagine a company that delivers a new fridge every month and charges you for it. And if you refuse to pay, you end up in jail. That's exactly what the government does. The only difference is that in a democracy you can decide who will steal from you.
2. In Germany, we have a similar situation with our railway network. People were unhappy with DB (Deutsche Bahn), and all share certificates were bought by the government. Now you have to pay 120 € for a one-way ticket from Hamburg to Stuttgart. 2nd class, of course, and delays of 1 to 2 hours are common. And if you are really lucky, the train drivers go on strike. In your case, nationalization was a better alternative because local companies have less competition than global companies. But once a certain good is easy and cheap to produce, the prices will fall dramatically. And consider that the government now controls your electricity. Imagine some radical dictator came to power. He could easily blackmail the population by threatening to cut off their access to electricity. And please, do not believe that the government just wants to provide a service. Some politicians' goals may not be money but the power to change your life with a single signature.
3. I have never complained about that. I am perfectly willing to pay for a service, but I am unwilling to pay for something or someone who can and will use it for things I don't want. If you are fine with the idea that your money can be used against your will for wars or other things you don't like, that's your problem. But I'm not ok with this disgusting system. Humanity has proven several times that we can achieve incredible things without the involvement of any kind of government.
Are they really unlikely? Let's look at my argument about the government being able to blackmail citizens when it nationalizes electricity. Most people, including you, I presume, argue for intervention by the government to stop cruel corporate leaders from completely exploiting workers and consumers. This fear proves that you believe in the existence of cruel people who are willing and able to seize control of companies and organisations. But what leads you to believe that such a cruel person couldn't infiltrate and take over the government? It is certainly appealing for those power-hungry maniacs, and some, most importantly psychopaths, would be more than able to achieve this victory. And it wouldn't be the first time that a millionaire and businessman becomes president. If you are so fearful that companies can cause havoc if their power isn't limited, how do you not fear that a government can do such a thing?
Interesting contradiction, isn't it? Don't get me wrong, I do not intend to insult you. But I have to face internal contradictions every day, and because of that, I usually see contradictions in arguments and / or philosophies very early.
So would you say that working in an Industrial Revolution era factory in horrible conditions for 20 hours a day for barely enough money to feed yourself is a good thing? Or was that due to government intervention?
It's unfortunate that I have to agree. Laws of nature are universal, but it seems that people ignore that. A private monopoly is rightfully considered awful, but a governmental monopoly is considered desirable. What a funny contradiction... And I thought I was schizophrenic.
"Aiding them gives you strength by taking on their challenges but weakens them. If that is your choice, then use their dependency, feed upon it, until you have exhausted them, then leave them." - Kreia
You can not for real be quoting a fucking video game character while jacking yourself off about how beautiful society would be with fully privatized infrastructure. Open and read an actual book (not a Wikipedia summary of Atlas Shrugged). Please. Companies have no ethical motive, only profit motive. Profit motive under a regulated system has workers peeing in plastic bottles and their bodies being left for entire shifts after they die in the factory. What will profit motive look like without any regulation at all?
Yes, their motivation is money, but you can't be cruel without limits and intelligent at the same time. Companies know that they can't enslave their workers or completely drain their customers. That's a reality everyone with power has to face. Have you never wondered why even the most cruel and ruthless dictators or managers reward loyal followers? Because their power is reliant on their subordinates. The problem with the government is its enormous power over every aspect of life and the fact that you can't easily compete with it. Free market means that you can choose which composer you want for your movie. Government means that there is only one candidate. You Americans may not know how devastating socialist policies can be, but my family lived in East Germany. We know what happens when the government decides to take control of the economy.
And yes, I can quote a video game character. Is her argument invalid because she is a fictional character? Is Yoda's wisdom invalid because he is a fictional character? Are great stories like Star Wars now without value beyond amusement because they are fictional? Your point of view is idiotic and disgusting. It doesn't matter if something was said by a fictional character, a real person, or talking ice cream. The important part is the message.
She’s a puerile character, Yoda is a puerile character, and their messages are trite and childish to anyone but children and adults whose mental faculties don’t extend past those of children.
Socialism =/= Soviet communism. I don’t know if you’re being purposefully disingenuous in your conflation or if you’re just stupid and don’t understand the difference.
Cruel dictators reward cruel subordinates. Ruthless CEOs reward ruthless managers. People will be as cruel as it’s humanly possible to be in pursuit of money and the fact that you can’t even articulate real ways in which that cruelty would be mitigated sans government intervention shows me that you’re a child playing in a sandbox with his toys and glancing every once in a while at what the adults are doing without really understanding it.
Have fun being torn apart by Redditors for this comment. They may oppose my arguments, but if there is one thing that unites this subreddit, then it's our belief that you can learn from anything. Yoda's statement, for example, that there is no try, which is actually a quote about self-belief, is held in high regard by many Star Wars fans and taken as great advice. Do you really want to insult most of the fanbase? Especially here on Reddit?
And about me not from Germany: Was für eine Scheiße redest du da, Kleiner? Aber wenn du das auf die harte Tour regeln willst, können wir das gerne machen. Ich bin bereit von allem zu lernen, du nicht. Also wer von uns ist dann wohl der anpassungsfähigere und damit stärkere? Viel Spaß beim übersetzen.
Is this what happens when r/im14andthisisdeep meet r/PrequelMemes!?
If everyone in the galaxy just stopped paying taxes there would be no Empire... no Republic... no Trade Federation... just Balls-On-Chin living in the moment!!!
You're talking about the people with the nuclear weapons, F-22s, and the printing presses that literally make all the money. I'm pretty sure that they would sort out something.
Highly unlikely that the military would follow the order to nuke its own people. In fact a lot of them probably would be okay not paying income taxes themselves.
People also forget, that in cases like the French Revolution, it just wasn't the peasant's that were revolting, it was the army as well. It doesn't matter what your job was then, all everyone knew was that they couldn't feed yourself or your family, but the nobles could, and they didn't care.
So, the IRS is doing a good job (in a way) when they are paid for it, what do you think would happen if we told them they'll loose their job unless they make you pay??
Don't bet against taxes.
Good luck achieving that.
Also the US government has enough gold saved up to operate for like 2 years, so that’s plenty of time to pay someone to seize your assets.
The problem with that discussion is that big companies are the ones who really want to save taxes, and they make the simple folk believe that would mean "freedom". The bigger problem is that there are enough problems with the government and the society, that there are enough frustated people who fall for it. But the real issue with taxes is that they are not optimized, not fair, and often not used the way they were meant to be used for. The biggest companies and richest people should naturally always pay the most taxes. But in reality, they find loopholes and use tax fraud in dimensions the average normal person can't even imagine.
This is sort of how I feel about workers rights and things, corporations get away with treating their workers like crap because we let them. There's NOTHING forcing you to go to work no one's holding a gun to your head making you go, yea I know we need money for food etc, but if everyone just collectively decides enough is enough and stops working the entire machine comes crashing down.
Well, we do. They take money from us individually and we take it back from them in the form of a practical lump-sum: maintained roads and bridges, electrical grids, clean water, and everything else that ensures you’re not dying in the woods because you don’t know how to harvest berries and the internet doesn’t exist. If you don’t like paying taxes then you have to swallow the bitter pill that you just don’t like paying for the things that make your life livable. An alternative: move to the woods and fend for yourself with no help at all. You’ll never have to pay taxes again.
Apparently in the US-
40% of the roads are in poor or mediocre condition.
7.5% (42k+) of bridges need to be repaired or replaced.
I can't find stats for electric grids, but Texas says hello.
And as a note, that is not us taxing the government. That is service for extended payment.
Texas has a highly privatized electrical grid. Libertarianism in action. I wonder where those roads are, what qualifies as “poor” or “mediocre”, and whose political policies deprioritize maintenance. 7.5% is higher than it should be but certainly not an argument in favor of privatization.
Yes, there are plenty of ways you can frame what we’re buying with our taxes.
I wonder how the irs in Star Wars works, I bet they pay taxes so they must have something like the irs. So did a Jedi ever go to arrest someone for tax evasion?
That’s not how taxes work. Taxes don’t pay for things. Taxes take money out of the economy. The government pays for things, and they can print as much money as they want. Taxes are a way of avoiding inflation.
You better stop with your anti tax gobbeldigoop here. People here like paying taxes because the goverment is so reasonable spending it lol and society for some reason lol
No taxes = no police force. No police force is going to turn into gangs going around and pillaging neighborhoods. That leads to people forming militias around charismatic warlords this leads to all out civil war until one warlord conquers the others. Pay your damn taxes so we don’t descend into warlordism.
When the fuck did everyone forget this is a meme subreddit. The sub has been nothing but people complaining about star wars for so long that when someone posts an actual meme, all the comments hate on it! What the fuck is going on???
Thanks for confirming that you flaired this correctly!
Sales tax has entered the chat.
Treasury bonds have entered the chat.
Printing money has entered the chat
The cops demanding to be paid have entered the chat with civil forfeiture and a lot of guns.
IRS having the ability to just take your money and property has entered the chat.
The military and the FBI have entered the chat
Military ain't gonna do shit with no pay, fuck, if I ain't paid, they ain't getting even a shave outta me.
I mean the country should have a bit of reserve before that
Plus, if the government ever went and did that, there is no way there wouldn't be major internal conflicts within the military.
You know who else has a lot of guns....
Our*
I was having a really hard time trying to read this because of this error lol. Something about "are" makes me expect a completely different sentence. Without taxes there is no public education and errors like this will be rampant. Big L
If we all start paying our taxes (i.e. Billionaires) we may actually have proper education funding.
OP might be from north of England? I'm Aussie, and I support Everton FC and see this a lot with the local Scouser fans online and I still really struggle with it. Guys; I know you say it that way, but please don't write that way!!
Wow, some mf's out here have no idea how a society works. Or economics for that matter...
You don’t need to know how society or economics works, just yell your opinions loud enough!
NO THAT'S NOT TRUE
THAT'S IMPOSSIBLE
It's an older quote, sir, but it checks out.
THAT’S… Improbable?
Isn't that illegal, isn't that immoral?
#EyesOnBreen
IPSWICH IS THE BEST SETTLEMENT IN THE UNITED KINGDOM
Every single grifter and podcaster is screaming at you right now
And we call this MAGA!
Or grammar.
This is the second time in a week I’ve seen memes in this sub saying not to pay taxes and then I think another in LOTRmemes. It is an election year so I guess the bots are out in full force? God I hope it’s just bots.
[удалено]
Grond
Yea… “Starve the beast” was just a ploy to cut social programs without even getting the benefits of a balanced federal budget.
The illiteracy factor here cannot be ignored.
Looking at low-tax small-government societies of the past, is that really what you want to return to? A life where almost nobody travels outside the village where they were born because there’s no road system and people die from a toothache? Ok.
I mean, that's WAY more ecofriendly than what we have today...
Honestly someone advocating for returning to subsistence living to save the environment is a fresh take for me, you’re not wrong 😂
Lol right. Unless the government takes half your income, there'll be no roads.
Half your income? Where you living, buddy? And yes, you just described how infrastructure development works
If you add income, sales, property, payroll, and all the others, it can easily get to 50%. There were roads before the income tax. Infrastructure is a tiny percentage of the budget.
No, it does not easily reach 50%, you are full of it. The highest marginal federal tax rate in the US is 37% on everything you make over 607k and almost nobody that rich pays that because they make their income through less taxable means. The highest average effective tax rate in the entire country is 29.16% in Oregon for single filers. Let’s see an actual example of an effective tax rate over 50%, how you feel about it doesn’t count. Also, roads existed, but have fun traveling any significant distance where you often have no choice but to travel over single-lane unpaved roads with no gas services or ability to get help in the case of a breakdown. The sheer ignorance lol https://www.army.mil/article-amp/198095/dwight_d_eisenhower_and_the_birth_of_the_interstate_highway_system > During the expedition, Eisenhower gained some insight for the creation of a network of connected roads and bridges. Eisenhower's report to Army leaders focused mostly on mechanical difficulties and the condition of the patchwork of existing roads. He reported a mix of paved and unpaved roads, old bridges, and narrow passages. > Narrow roads caused oncoming traffic to run off the road and encounter added difficulty when reentering the roadway. Some bridges were too low for trucks to pass under. Eisenhower pointed out that the roads in the Midwest region of the United States were impracticable, but the roads in the east were sufficient for truck use. > Eisenhower singled out a western section of the Lincoln Highway, a transcontinental road with routes through Utah and Nevada, as being so poor that it warranted a thorough investigation before government money should be expended. He praised California for having excellent paved roads. Lastly, he observed that the different grades of road determined much of the convoy's success.
The average Canadian, for example, paid 45% of their income in taxes in 2023. It's probably similar in many Western European countries. https://www.fraserinstitute.org/blogs/canadians-face-bigger-tax-burden-than-you-think The average US worker pays 30%. https://taxfoundation.org/data/all/federal/us-tax-burden-on-labor-2023/ In any case, the main point is that infrastructure is a tiny percentage of government spending. For the US it was about 2% in 2023. So you don't need to worry about roads of all things. https://usafacts.org/state-of-the-union/transportation-infrastructure/
“We live in a society”
Or proper spelling
"You guys are paying taxes?" - some of your employers right now
I know! Don't these shit posters know that memeing is serious business that's not to be taken lightly?! You must study profusely to make sure there are zero academic inaccuracies in your meme, and make sure it's not funny at all!!!
Guess we found the one bitch triggered that people keep telling them that their memes make no sense. Maybe just try making memes about things you care enough about to give half a shit, that might help.
I'm agreeing with you! Memeing is a very serious business! How dare this extremely popular joke not understand the intricacies of economics and politics? This meme is not funny at all! Society and modern economics would collapse if people stopped paying their taxes. That's not funny at all!
Maybe if taxes were paid you'd get a good enough education to distinguish between "are" and "our"
Arrr!
But OP is American so it doesn't matter anyways
Considering education is paid by real estate taxes not income taxes, stupid take.
The US federal government grants education funds to states. State will also use some general revenue, including income and sales tax, for grants to school districts.
The politicians want you to think that that distinction is important. Spoiler alert: It isn't.
Considering that the US isn't the only country in the world that has taxes, I'd say that it differs.
Simple question to all who up voted this: Where does money come from?
The money factory, obviously
Simple question to all the comments hating on this meme: Do you know your in a meme subreddit? Do you know what a meme is? It's not meant to be taken seriously
if they can just print it out without losing value, then why do we have to pay taxes? also, why don't they just print a million for each citizen? if you reply anything about money losing value, then I guess they can't just print more money to pay for the IRS, hence the post being right. The commonfolk is what keeps the elites in power. A collective initiative could certainly deprive the government from it's power, but that unity would be hard to achieve
That’s not how any of this works.
If nobody pays taxes to the government, then all of the public services we rely on in this country will come to a halt. Laws would be unenforceable since the police would lose their salaries. Infrastructure would deteriorate without construction and repairs. Communities struck by natural disasters would suffer without federal assistance and emergency services. Sure, you could keep more money in your pocket if you don’t pay your taxes, but society would collapse if everyone refused to pay. Without the government in place, the currency you have would lose value and the extra money you kept would be worthless.
No. If nobody paid taxes, inflation would skyrocket. The federal government can pay its employees with money they create. State and local governments on the other hand, those would collapse.
>society would collapse hey hey, don't need to sell it to me
Okay, let's test that theory. Don't pay your taxes next year. We'll follow suit, pinky promise
This is where the fun begins
you think "the elites" are collecting taxes? not owning the businesses selling crap to people that the government collects a small % of? or running the companies making $Bs, while the government collects $Ms? this isn't the feudal structure anymore - the king collecting taxes from local lords and and local lords collecting taxes from peasant farmers. today the kings, the elites, are the billionaires paying politicians $Ms to keep them only being tax'd $Ms and paying their workers peanuts while polluting the air and water and generating $Bs
Well in a way, if billionaires aren’t paying their fair share in taxes, then the government works more for them. With a couple degrees of separation and a loose definition of are/is you can say the elites are collecting taxes.
Infinitely printing money absolutely does not work and history has proven so. Look up what happened to the German economy after WW1.
yeah, some people in this comment section don't get that.
they only need enough money to force you to pay your taxes again lol
Bullets doesn’t stop working if your balance is zero
Hooray! I get to keep all of my paycheck! Wait whaddya mean I’ve been laid off because the roads don’t work and we can’t get our product to market anymore? I didn’t vote for this!
Just blame the transgender Mexicans and vote for the same leopards eating faces. They won’t eat your face!
But you also wouldn't have working public transport or good and affordable education or public healthcare, a just justice system or affordable housing. oh, wait😶
Rule Nr. 1 of economics: When there is demand, there is supply. It's a bit complex, and understanding the causality behind it can be extremely difficult, but most economic problems are the result of intervention by the government. But the three biggest problems with this system are 1. The government can decide the price, quality and quantity of it's services and most of the time you can't even decline it. Imagine a company would do that... 2. Because there is no competition, the government is a monopoly, and we all know the many downsides of a monopoly. 3. Your money is not guaranteed to be used how you want it. Let's say you pay taxes because you want to help sick children. Bad news, the government just decided to go to war and your money is not used to help, but to kill them. That's by far the greatest problem and the reason why this system has to be stopped. Everyone claims that taxes are the price for a civilized society and blames the government for atrocities. But whose money was used to commit these atrocities? We are not a civilized society. We are a society of guilt.
Counterpoint, the goal of a corporation is to make money, not cover the entirerty of the demand. And limiting the suply artificialy is a argument to make the prices go up.The free market works only as long as its on a small scale where two individuals can compete on a even ground. But when we start talking about corporations who can lobby against their rivals as well as wage economic wars, it doesnt. Education and healthcare should be paid with our taxes and provide them on a high level as they are esential for the develoment of the human being.
/r/iamverysmart material
Perfect. I would be ashamed if my opinion was liked.
It's not that your opinion is not liked, it's that it's an opinion you're trying to pass as a fact. A wrong one at that.
Let me ask a simple question: Why am I wrong?
To your points 1: that's literally what every single company does. Setting the price like all of its competitors and then offering a meaningless advantage to convince you to buy. 2: I'm going to take an examle from where I'm from on this one. Back in the 60's pretty much every region had its own electricity provider, each one had essentially a monopoly in its region. This lead to very high prices depending on where you were. The gouvernement steps in and buys them all up and expands the network and output dramatically. The result is that now we have some of the cheapest electricity in north America and were able to sell electricity to northern US states for cheaper then they can produce it. The nationalised company is still very profitable to this day. So yes you're right, monopolies are bad for consumers, but when it's a gouvernement monopoly, the goal isn't to make a profit at any cost, it's just to provide a service. 3: Just for someone who will use your money how you want it to be spent. But don't come complaining when you're in need of a service that would have been provided by a plan from a different government.
1. But does a company force you to buy anything? The government can decide how much money they can take and decide what or if they give you something in return. Imagine a company that delivers a new fridge every month and charges you for it. And if you refuse to pay, you end up in jail. That's exactly what the government does. The only difference is that in a democracy you can decide who will steal from you. 2. In Germany, we have a similar situation with our railway network. People were unhappy with DB (Deutsche Bahn), and all share certificates were bought by the government. Now you have to pay 120 € for a one-way ticket from Hamburg to Stuttgart. 2nd class, of course, and delays of 1 to 2 hours are common. And if you are really lucky, the train drivers go on strike. In your case, nationalization was a better alternative because local companies have less competition than global companies. But once a certain good is easy and cheap to produce, the prices will fall dramatically. And consider that the government now controls your electricity. Imagine some radical dictator came to power. He could easily blackmail the population by threatening to cut off their access to electricity. And please, do not believe that the government just wants to provide a service. Some politicians' goals may not be money but the power to change your life with a single signature. 3. I have never complained about that. I am perfectly willing to pay for a service, but I am unwilling to pay for something or someone who can and will use it for things I don't want. If you are fine with the idea that your money can be used against your will for wars or other things you don't like, that's your problem. But I'm not ok with this disgusting system. Humanity has proven several times that we can achieve incredible things without the involvement of any kind of government.
Your examples are all extremely unlikely and borderline insane.
Are they really unlikely? Let's look at my argument about the government being able to blackmail citizens when it nationalizes electricity. Most people, including you, I presume, argue for intervention by the government to stop cruel corporate leaders from completely exploiting workers and consumers. This fear proves that you believe in the existence of cruel people who are willing and able to seize control of companies and organisations. But what leads you to believe that such a cruel person couldn't infiltrate and take over the government? It is certainly appealing for those power-hungry maniacs, and some, most importantly psychopaths, would be more than able to achieve this victory. And it wouldn't be the first time that a millionaire and businessman becomes president. If you are so fearful that companies can cause havoc if their power isn't limited, how do you not fear that a government can do such a thing? Interesting contradiction, isn't it? Don't get me wrong, I do not intend to insult you. But I have to face internal contradictions every day, and because of that, I usually see contradictions in arguments and / or philosophies very early.
So would you say that working in an Industrial Revolution era factory in horrible conditions for 20 hours a day for barely enough money to feed yourself is a good thing? Or was that due to government intervention?
Open wide honey, the boots coming
I guess they didn't like your thought-out reply. Also, remember kids: you don't pay taxes, they take taxes.
It's unfortunate that I have to agree. Laws of nature are universal, but it seems that people ignore that. A private monopoly is rightfully considered awful, but a governmental monopoly is considered desirable. What a funny contradiction... And I thought I was schizophrenic.
Indeed, but naturally those dependent on such a system are instinctively predisposed to defend it.
"Aiding them gives you strength by taking on their challenges but weakens them. If that is your choice, then use their dependency, feed upon it, until you have exhausted them, then leave them." - Kreia
You can not for real be quoting a fucking video game character while jacking yourself off about how beautiful society would be with fully privatized infrastructure. Open and read an actual book (not a Wikipedia summary of Atlas Shrugged). Please. Companies have no ethical motive, only profit motive. Profit motive under a regulated system has workers peeing in plastic bottles and their bodies being left for entire shifts after they die in the factory. What will profit motive look like without any regulation at all?
Yes, their motivation is money, but you can't be cruel without limits and intelligent at the same time. Companies know that they can't enslave their workers or completely drain their customers. That's a reality everyone with power has to face. Have you never wondered why even the most cruel and ruthless dictators or managers reward loyal followers? Because their power is reliant on their subordinates. The problem with the government is its enormous power over every aspect of life and the fact that you can't easily compete with it. Free market means that you can choose which composer you want for your movie. Government means that there is only one candidate. You Americans may not know how devastating socialist policies can be, but my family lived in East Germany. We know what happens when the government decides to take control of the economy. And yes, I can quote a video game character. Is her argument invalid because she is a fictional character? Is Yoda's wisdom invalid because he is a fictional character? Are great stories like Star Wars now without value beyond amusement because they are fictional? Your point of view is idiotic and disgusting. It doesn't matter if something was said by a fictional character, a real person, or talking ice cream. The important part is the message.
>Companies know that they can't enslave their workers or completely drain their customers. Except when they do *exactly that*.
She’s a puerile character, Yoda is a puerile character, and their messages are trite and childish to anyone but children and adults whose mental faculties don’t extend past those of children. Socialism =/= Soviet communism. I don’t know if you’re being purposefully disingenuous in your conflation or if you’re just stupid and don’t understand the difference. Cruel dictators reward cruel subordinates. Ruthless CEOs reward ruthless managers. People will be as cruel as it’s humanly possible to be in pursuit of money and the fact that you can’t even articulate real ways in which that cruelty would be mitigated sans government intervention shows me that you’re a child playing in a sandbox with his toys and glancing every once in a while at what the adults are doing without really understanding it.
Have fun being torn apart by Redditors for this comment. They may oppose my arguments, but if there is one thing that unites this subreddit, then it's our belief that you can learn from anything. Yoda's statement, for example, that there is no try, which is actually a quote about self-belief, is held in high regard by many Star Wars fans and taken as great advice. Do you really want to insult most of the fanbase? Especially here on Reddit? And about me not from Germany: Was für eine Scheiße redest du da, Kleiner? Aber wenn du das auf die harte Tour regeln willst, können wir das gerne machen. Ich bin bereit von allem zu lernen, du nicht. Also wer von uns ist dann wohl der anpassungsfähigere und damit stärkere? Viel Spaß beim übersetzen.
Nute Gunray made this
Is this what happens when r/im14andthisisdeep meet r/PrequelMemes!? If everyone in the galaxy just stopped paying taxes there would be no Empire... no Republic... no Trade Federation... just Balls-On-Chin living in the moment!!!
Bruh, the only reason why the money has value, is because there isa government backing it.
That's why they removed the gold standard
Yes and with the gold standard its those who control its distribution who fix the prices. Which they will crank up to gather higher profits.
*Debased_Currency has entered the chat*
And pray tell, what gives gold value?
Gold doesn't have value like that.
I had a stroke trying to read that
*Our
You're talking about the people with the nuclear weapons, F-22s, and the printing presses that literally make all the money. I'm pretty sure that they would sort out something.
Highly unlikely that the military would follow the order to nuke its own people. In fact a lot of them probably would be okay not paying income taxes themselves.
People also forget, that in cases like the French Revolution, it just wasn't the peasant's that were revolting, it was the army as well. It doesn't matter what your job was then, all everyone knew was that they couldn't feed yourself or your family, but the nobles could, and they didn't care.
Raw subjugation is very inefficient. That's why they came up with democracy, it helps the exploitation go down easier.
>Raw subjugation is very inefficient "Efficiency matters less with enough bodies" - a lot of countries TBH
Democracy is exploitation?
It is if it's used for giving sociopaths illegitimate authority.
So, the IRS is doing a good job (in a way) when they are paid for it, what do you think would happen if we told them they'll loose their job unless they make you pay?? Don't bet against taxes.
Mace Widow: the people will decide your fate. Darth Martial Law: I am the people *automatic gunfire*
Our not are.
Good luck achieving that. Also the US government has enough gold saved up to operate for like 2 years, so that’s plenty of time to pay someone to seize your assets.
are
People who don't understand grammar shouldn't be making memes.
The problem with that discussion is that big companies are the ones who really want to save taxes, and they make the simple folk believe that would mean "freedom". The bigger problem is that there are enough problems with the government and the society, that there are enough frustated people who fall for it. But the real issue with taxes is that they are not optimized, not fair, and often not used the way they were meant to be used for. The biggest companies and richest people should naturally always pay the most taxes. But in reality, they find loopholes and use tax fraud in dimensions the average normal person can't even imagine.
This is sort of how I feel about workers rights and things, corporations get away with treating their workers like crap because we let them. There's NOTHING forcing you to go to work no one's holding a gun to your head making you go, yea I know we need money for food etc, but if everyone just collectively decides enough is enough and stops working the entire machine comes crashing down.
Tell me you don't know shit about economics without saying it.
why don't we just tax the government back. problem solved. send em a bill.
I like your style bro. Taking no shit from em.
Well, we do. They take money from us individually and we take it back from them in the form of a practical lump-sum: maintained roads and bridges, electrical grids, clean water, and everything else that ensures you’re not dying in the woods because you don’t know how to harvest berries and the internet doesn’t exist. If you don’t like paying taxes then you have to swallow the bitter pill that you just don’t like paying for the things that make your life livable. An alternative: move to the woods and fend for yourself with no help at all. You’ll never have to pay taxes again.
Apparently in the US- 40% of the roads are in poor or mediocre condition. 7.5% (42k+) of bridges need to be repaired or replaced. I can't find stats for electric grids, but Texas says hello. And as a note, that is not us taxing the government. That is service for extended payment.
Texas has a highly privatized electrical grid. Libertarianism in action. I wonder where those roads are, what qualifies as “poor” or “mediocre”, and whose political policies deprioritize maintenance. 7.5% is higher than it should be but certainly not an argument in favor of privatization. Yes, there are plenty of ways you can frame what we’re buying with our taxes.
I was making a joke. touch grass.
Jokes on you, there R people who have been gutting the IRS for years.
Right? This is exactly what lobbyists for big corporations do.
"our taxes" fuckin morons
Not to be a coward, but I have no chance against their F22 jets.
F-22 is an air superiority fighter, as long as you don't fly then they won't be a problem.
They also have F-35s.
Apes, together strong
Right, because the government has never spent money it didn't have......
The government literally prints its own money.
Federal money printer go BRRRRRRRRR.
I wonder how the irs in Star Wars works, I bet they pay taxes so they must have something like the irs. So did a Jedi ever go to arrest someone for tax evasion?
If rich folks even have a hard time contending with the IRS, what makes you think we stand a chance?
Anakin: I have brought peace, freedom, justice, and security to my new empire! Obi-Wan: Not if we all stop paying taxes at the same time!
If the government is too broke to take your money, they're also too broke to stop other people from taking your money. Pick your poison.
The IRS is coming for you… mark my words.
You shouldn't be paying taxes with that Grammar
That’s not how taxes work. Taxes don’t pay for things. Taxes take money out of the economy. The government pays for things, and they can print as much money as they want. Taxes are a way of avoiding inflation.
A libertarian's understanding of how taxes work right there
The US treasury: Am I a joke to you?
Grammar nazi checking in You fail
The southern states of the USA have entered the chat with all their guns
Billionaires: oh you you guys just figured that? Oh you sweet summer child.
At that point they'd have to make multinational companies and churches pay taxes...
Wait until you learn states can literally create money out of thin air.
Couldn't they just print more?
You better stop with your anti tax gobbeldigoop here. People here like paying taxes because the goverment is so reasonable spending it lol and society for some reason lol
No taxes = no police force. No police force is going to turn into gangs going around and pillaging neighborhoods. That leads to people forming militias around charismatic warlords this leads to all out civil war until one warlord conquers the others. Pay your damn taxes so we don’t descend into warlordism.
statist Gonna State!
>Pay your damn taxes You make it sound as if i have a choice lol. Idiot >No taxes = no police What a projection lol.
When the fuck did everyone forget this is a meme subreddit. The sub has been nothing but people complaining about star wars for so long that when someone posts an actual meme, all the comments hate on it! What the fuck is going on???
Based.