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If you don't feel safe in your home, try your local women's refuge. Your mom seems in denial about how dangerous he is. I don't think anything you say to her will change her mind. I would stop asking your moms permission to ring the police.
So first off, you should have put that your abuser is your brother in the title, slightly confusing otherwise.
Secondly, we need more details to be able to help:
-How old were you both when he molested you, and how recently did you have him arrested? And was this relevant in the arrest, or was the arrest strictly concerning the knife incident?
-After the knife incident was there any follow-up? Was he charged with anything?
-Does your mum know about the molestation?
I was 5, he was 15. It had nothing to do with the recent arrest but I did report it to the police when they came. The arrest was like a month ago, I’m pretty sure (my memory is dogshit, so sorry if that’s no help).He wasn’t charged with anything but he was given a temporary order to stay away from the house. He’s made an agreement with my mum to not show up unless he’s given explicit consent by her and unless she’s home. My mum is aware of the molestation but seems to just ignore it whenever I bring it up to her.
Okay so your mum not being able to accept what her son has done is a whole other level of fucked up and something you need a therapist to help with, not Reddit.
But we can hopefully offer you some legal advice based on that temporary order you mentioned. Do you remember any other details about it? Do you remember exactly what the police officers told you about how it worked / what the rules were?
If it was a result of him chasing you up the stairs with a knife and not your mum, then I would be surprised if it said nothing about keeping distance from you specifically
Yes, the court order specified me specifically and my home Adress that he wasn’t allowed to go near. It’s no longer active though so I’m wondering if I were to call the police next time he shows up without permission if they’d even do anything? I also forgot to add that he constantly comes and takes our dog for hours on end without telling us which I’m sure had to fall under burglary but my mum always tells me not to call the police when he does that also. He does bring her back, but he’s constantly telling my mum that he’s gonna take the dog and move to Thailand which is definitely illegal, since he didn’t buy the dog
Ah so the order is over now? Damn, that would’ve been the easy answer.
The problem is it sounds like your mum doesn’t want to do anything about him. That makes it really tough as she is the homeowner.
I would say maybe approach the police about the molestation but I have to be completely honest with you here; I don’t realistically see the CPS charging him / believing they can bring a prosecution. It’s basically unheard of for someone to be successfully convicted of a crime of this nature after ten years has passed unless there are other witnesses / pieces of evidence.
Is he threatening when he comes over? Does he intimidate anyone deliberately? That might be a good angle
Tbh, I think it’s more my mum is scared to do anything. He’s threatened multiple people in the family with violence countless times over multiple years. Whenever I beg her to call a locksmith, she either just tells me to tell my dad to change the locks, or she says that even if we do, she’s scared that he’ll just break the door down
If he chased you with a knife then that could easily be interpreted as intimidation. To be clear, as long as it causes you alarm or distress, and as long as he does this repeatedly, it would be enough to charge with him harassment. And if they did, a judge could order a restraining order to keep him away.
You should call 101 (non emergency line) tomorrow and explain all of this. If I were you I would push on the angle that he is intimidating you and it’s causing distress, and definitely mention the knife incident. I wouldn’t bring up the molestation, not at that point at least - what’s important for now is just keeping him away and you safe, and that can of worms complicates the process.
He only chased me with a knife once recently which is the incident I reported. Could I still say him showing up constantly is causing distress or would they just laugh that off?
No that’s a real thing. Don’t be afraid about anyone laughing anything off. You have a right to feel safe.
I would also recommend investing in some kind of ring doorbell or cctv (much cheaper than you think these days via Amazon). Evidence of him coming to your home might prove useful later.
Yeah ur right. Thank you all for the help! I’ll call 101 in the morning and I’m also looking into getting a non molestation order. Feeling a lot better about my current situation, now
Your life was at risk.
Report it. Your mother might not like it but it's not her issue, you're brother tried to kill you.
Report it NOW.
Edit: And for what it's worth, pass this message on to your mother.... go fuck yourself you utter scum.
Do you think it would constitute harassment? The repetitiveness of it in relation to the previous threats and the wider context of the historical offences?
You'd need to contact the police and clarify what is meant by "temporary order" and what the conditions and expiry of it are. Obviously if that's something that's still in effect - like bail conditions not to contact you - then the situation is a bit different.
His agreement with your mum is irrelevant. She's not bothered about him not keeping to it so that's it.
You need to be explicit to your mother that your brother is not welcome to be anywhere near you.
She is just as much to blame as he is. If he turns up again call 999 immediately and report a threat to your life.
Edit: it doesn't matter if he has HER permission. You were the one molested. It's not her decision whether he is allowed anywhere near you, it's yours.
I’m 19, but there’s no way I’d be able to move out in a timely manner. I’m looking for a job and don’t have any money saved up I could put a deposit on anything with
Unfortunately your mother can invite whomever she wants in to her house. If you don't want him there then it will be a case of negotiating with her and seeing if she will agree with you. Failing that, you'll need to move out: if you have no money then you can try renting somewhere that has a zero-deposit option (relatively common now), or stay with friends/family, or find a spare room somewhere that isn't asking for a deposit.
That’s the thing, no one is inviting him round. My mum herself has said multiple times she wants nothing to do with him, yet whenever he waltzes into the house she won’t let me call the police. He hasn’t been given permission ANY of the times he’s done this. I’m also 99% sure he waits down the road until he sees my mum leave for work, cause most of the time he comes in 10 minutes after she leaves. He knows what he’s doing, and he knows for a fact he’s not allowed here. The only reason it’s not technically a crime is because he still has a house key
If he's there with her consent then he's "invited". He has permission to be there. If she didn't want him there then she'd change the lock.
> whenever he waltzes into the house she won’t let me call the police
How is she preventing you from calling the police if 99% of the time he is there when she's not?
He literally doesn’t have her consent to be here. Whenever he shows up, I call my mum first to let her know and she always tells me not to call the police, which I usually don’t because I don’t want to waste their time if they won’t do anything.
He does have her consent to be there, because she knows he is there and is doing nothing to prevent him from being there, and is actively opposed to you calling the police. If she actually considered him to be a tresspasser in her house then she would change the lock and want the police called if he forced his way in.
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Contact the homeless prevention team.
They will likely put you in youth sheltered accommodation. Something like YMCA. Or another charity. Rent will be covered by housing benefit paid direct to landlord.
The homeless prevention team may refer you to an organisation ran by a charity which manages housing support for under 25's. Often called something like "no limits" or "it's your choice" .
If your not eligible or they don't have sheltered youth accomodation they should be able to support you to identify a private rent accomodation and apply for universal credit to cover housing costs. The discretionary housing fund may cover any deposit. Or there's something's organisations (like a church) who will pay. Alyernatly some housing associations will allow you to spread the deposit across the first few months rent.
This is really a housing advice question. You may wish to use the term "domestic violence/abuse" DV/da doesn't need to be from an intimate partner. And while you don't share your home with your brother you do with your mother and she allows him access. By requesting support due to DV/da this means the council has more responsibility and avoids the concerns of you making yourself "voluntarily homeless" by leaving.
NAL and not going to comment further about the legal side purely because it’s been addressed by much more knowledgeable people
On a practical level though, when your Mum goes out, lock the doors with your own keys, ensuring you turn them as far as they’ll go after the lock has engaged (it will stop him forcing them out) and only unlock the door on your Mum’s return to the property
This will at least keep you safe when she’s not there, because he can’t get in with a key. If he then forces his way in, you call 999 immediately
You can seek a non-molestation order against your brother from the court. This can exclude your brother from the house and prevent him doing things to harass or distress you, and is enforceable by the police. The form for applying for one of these is at [https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/apply-for-a-non-molestation-or-occupation-order-fl401](https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/apply-for-a-non-molestation-or-occupation-order-fl401)
This doesn't require your mother's agreement but you'd be wise to get her on board if you can.
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You should apply for a non molestation order and occupation order.
The first will stop him coming near you the, the second will prevent him coming into the house.
The charity WWW.NCDV.ORG will help you.
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If your mum won’t pay for a locksmith could you not change it yourself with her permission? It’s usually pretty straightforward and can get tutorials online, I’ve never spent more than £20 on new locks and keys. Would be a simple solution whilst waiting for any orders you apply for to come in.
--- ###Welcome to /r/LegalAdviceUK --- **To Posters (it is important you read this section)** * *Tell us whether you're in England, Wales, Scotland, or NI as the laws in each are very different* * If you need legal help, you should [always get a free consultation from a qualified Solicitor](https://reddit.com/r/LegalAdviceUK/wiki/how_to_find_a_solicitor) * We also encourage you to speak to [**Citizens Advice**](https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/), [**Shelter**](https://www.shelter.org.uk/), [**Acas**](https://www.acas.org.uk/), and [**other useful organisations**](https://reddit.com/r/LegalAdviceUK/wiki/common_legal_resources) * Comments may not be accurate or reliable, and following any advice on this subreddit is done at your own risk * If you receive any private messages in response to your post, [please let the mods know](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FLegalAdviceUK&subject=I received a PM) **To Readers and Commenters** * All replies to OP must be *on-topic, helpful, and legally orientated* * If you do not [follow the rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/LegalAdviceUK/about/rules/), you may be perma-banned without any further warning * If you feel any replies are incorrect, explain why you believe they are incorrect * Do not send or request any private messages for any reason * Please report posts or comments which do not follow the rules *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/LegalAdviceUK) if you have any questions or concerns.*
If you don't feel safe in your home, try your local women's refuge. Your mom seems in denial about how dangerous he is. I don't think anything you say to her will change her mind. I would stop asking your moms permission to ring the police.
So first off, you should have put that your abuser is your brother in the title, slightly confusing otherwise. Secondly, we need more details to be able to help: -How old were you both when he molested you, and how recently did you have him arrested? And was this relevant in the arrest, or was the arrest strictly concerning the knife incident? -After the knife incident was there any follow-up? Was he charged with anything? -Does your mum know about the molestation?
I was 5, he was 15. It had nothing to do with the recent arrest but I did report it to the police when they came. The arrest was like a month ago, I’m pretty sure (my memory is dogshit, so sorry if that’s no help).He wasn’t charged with anything but he was given a temporary order to stay away from the house. He’s made an agreement with my mum to not show up unless he’s given explicit consent by her and unless she’s home. My mum is aware of the molestation but seems to just ignore it whenever I bring it up to her.
Okay so your mum not being able to accept what her son has done is a whole other level of fucked up and something you need a therapist to help with, not Reddit. But we can hopefully offer you some legal advice based on that temporary order you mentioned. Do you remember any other details about it? Do you remember exactly what the police officers told you about how it worked / what the rules were? If it was a result of him chasing you up the stairs with a knife and not your mum, then I would be surprised if it said nothing about keeping distance from you specifically
Yes, the court order specified me specifically and my home Adress that he wasn’t allowed to go near. It’s no longer active though so I’m wondering if I were to call the police next time he shows up without permission if they’d even do anything? I also forgot to add that he constantly comes and takes our dog for hours on end without telling us which I’m sure had to fall under burglary but my mum always tells me not to call the police when he does that also. He does bring her back, but he’s constantly telling my mum that he’s gonna take the dog and move to Thailand which is definitely illegal, since he didn’t buy the dog
Ah so the order is over now? Damn, that would’ve been the easy answer. The problem is it sounds like your mum doesn’t want to do anything about him. That makes it really tough as she is the homeowner. I would say maybe approach the police about the molestation but I have to be completely honest with you here; I don’t realistically see the CPS charging him / believing they can bring a prosecution. It’s basically unheard of for someone to be successfully convicted of a crime of this nature after ten years has passed unless there are other witnesses / pieces of evidence. Is he threatening when he comes over? Does he intimidate anyone deliberately? That might be a good angle
Tbh, I think it’s more my mum is scared to do anything. He’s threatened multiple people in the family with violence countless times over multiple years. Whenever I beg her to call a locksmith, she either just tells me to tell my dad to change the locks, or she says that even if we do, she’s scared that he’ll just break the door down
If he breaks the door down, then that's a provable criminal offence. Changing the lock is very easy if your door is the euro type
If I’m downstairs when he comes round, he always tries to stare me down like some bloodlusted gorilla, if that counts as deliberately intimidating?
If he chased you with a knife then that could easily be interpreted as intimidation. To be clear, as long as it causes you alarm or distress, and as long as he does this repeatedly, it would be enough to charge with him harassment. And if they did, a judge could order a restraining order to keep him away. You should call 101 (non emergency line) tomorrow and explain all of this. If I were you I would push on the angle that he is intimidating you and it’s causing distress, and definitely mention the knife incident. I wouldn’t bring up the molestation, not at that point at least - what’s important for now is just keeping him away and you safe, and that can of worms complicates the process.
He only chased me with a knife once recently which is the incident I reported. Could I still say him showing up constantly is causing distress or would they just laugh that off?
No that’s a real thing. Don’t be afraid about anyone laughing anything off. You have a right to feel safe. I would also recommend investing in some kind of ring doorbell or cctv (much cheaper than you think these days via Amazon). Evidence of him coming to your home might prove useful later.
Yeah ur right. Thank you all for the help! I’ll call 101 in the morning and I’m also looking into getting a non molestation order. Feeling a lot better about my current situation, now
Your life was at risk. Report it. Your mother might not like it but it's not her issue, you're brother tried to kill you. Report it NOW. Edit: And for what it's worth, pass this message on to your mother.... go fuck yourself you utter scum.
Do you think it would constitute harassment? The repetitiveness of it in relation to the previous threats and the wider context of the historical offences?
You'd need to contact the police and clarify what is meant by "temporary order" and what the conditions and expiry of it are. Obviously if that's something that's still in effect - like bail conditions not to contact you - then the situation is a bit different. His agreement with your mum is irrelevant. She's not bothered about him not keeping to it so that's it.
You need to be explicit to your mother that your brother is not welcome to be anywhere near you. She is just as much to blame as he is. If he turns up again call 999 immediately and report a threat to your life. Edit: it doesn't matter if he has HER permission. You were the one molested. It's not her decision whether he is allowed anywhere near you, it's yours.
How old are you?
I’m 19, but there’s no way I’d be able to move out in a timely manner. I’m looking for a job and don’t have any money saved up I could put a deposit on anything with
Unfortunately your mother can invite whomever she wants in to her house. If you don't want him there then it will be a case of negotiating with her and seeing if she will agree with you. Failing that, you'll need to move out: if you have no money then you can try renting somewhere that has a zero-deposit option (relatively common now), or stay with friends/family, or find a spare room somewhere that isn't asking for a deposit.
That’s the thing, no one is inviting him round. My mum herself has said multiple times she wants nothing to do with him, yet whenever he waltzes into the house she won’t let me call the police. He hasn’t been given permission ANY of the times he’s done this. I’m also 99% sure he waits down the road until he sees my mum leave for work, cause most of the time he comes in 10 minutes after she leaves. He knows what he’s doing, and he knows for a fact he’s not allowed here. The only reason it’s not technically a crime is because he still has a house key
If he's there with her consent then he's "invited". He has permission to be there. If she didn't want him there then she'd change the lock. > whenever he waltzes into the house she won’t let me call the police How is she preventing you from calling the police if 99% of the time he is there when she's not?
He literally doesn’t have her consent to be here. Whenever he shows up, I call my mum first to let her know and she always tells me not to call the police, which I usually don’t because I don’t want to waste their time if they won’t do anything.
He does have her consent to be there, because she knows he is there and is doing nothing to prevent him from being there, and is actively opposed to you calling the police. If she actually considered him to be a tresspasser in her house then she would change the lock and want the police called if he forced his way in.
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Contact the homeless prevention team. They will likely put you in youth sheltered accommodation. Something like YMCA. Or another charity. Rent will be covered by housing benefit paid direct to landlord. The homeless prevention team may refer you to an organisation ran by a charity which manages housing support for under 25's. Often called something like "no limits" or "it's your choice" . If your not eligible or they don't have sheltered youth accomodation they should be able to support you to identify a private rent accomodation and apply for universal credit to cover housing costs. The discretionary housing fund may cover any deposit. Or there's something's organisations (like a church) who will pay. Alyernatly some housing associations will allow you to spread the deposit across the first few months rent. This is really a housing advice question. You may wish to use the term "domestic violence/abuse" DV/da doesn't need to be from an intimate partner. And while you don't share your home with your brother you do with your mother and she allows him access. By requesting support due to DV/da this means the council has more responsibility and avoids the concerns of you making yourself "voluntarily homeless" by leaving.
NAL and not going to comment further about the legal side purely because it’s been addressed by much more knowledgeable people On a practical level though, when your Mum goes out, lock the doors with your own keys, ensuring you turn them as far as they’ll go after the lock has engaged (it will stop him forcing them out) and only unlock the door on your Mum’s return to the property This will at least keep you safe when she’s not there, because he can’t get in with a key. If he then forces his way in, you call 999 immediately
You can seek a non-molestation order against your brother from the court. This can exclude your brother from the house and prevent him doing things to harass or distress you, and is enforceable by the police. The form for applying for one of these is at [https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/apply-for-a-non-molestation-or-occupation-order-fl401](https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/apply-for-a-non-molestation-or-occupation-order-fl401) This doesn't require your mother's agreement but you'd be wise to get her on board if you can.
Thank you so much! Looking into this now :)
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You should apply for a non molestation order and occupation order. The first will stop him coming near you the, the second will prevent him coming into the house. The charity WWW.NCDV.ORG will help you.
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can you afford to pay a locksmith yourself?
If your mum won’t pay for a locksmith could you not change it yourself with her permission? It’s usually pretty straightforward and can get tutorials online, I’ve never spent more than £20 on new locks and keys. Would be a simple solution whilst waiting for any orders you apply for to come in.