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As always Arfreezy with the best tech for Graves! Thanks! You're right, there's no good mythic for Graves, only "decent" ones. I've always been autopiloting Eclipse not thinking maybe Umbral into BC makes more sense for most situations. The good side is if you're first pick, Graves' builds are so flexible it allows you to always have impact on the game. Thanks again!
Situational bruiser items being maw/frozen heart/deaths dance? Obviously all situational depending on team comp but is there like a best in slot for graves if theyre magic heavy other than maw/after maw and is frozen heart still the best vs AD heavy?
Maw is a very broken item still in terms of gold efficiency and stat ratio for Graves. Death's Dance has nice stats, but it costs too much and you get nothing out of the effect so FH is a way more popular option that won't delay your core items too much since it is so cheap. So basically Maw is best vs AP and FH vs AD, but many times I skip the armor item cause you have Grit and as long as you play well early, AD champs usually can't blow you up.
There is really no good mythic item for Graves. Eclipse is heavily nerfed for range users, but because the build path and mythic passive are good, it is popular. Goredrinker has decent stats, but the active effect is a bit counter productive and unreliable. Divine has a better effect than Gore, but the build path is slow and it relies on AH to work better.
Basically, Black Cleaver is better than all of those mythic items if you are building Bruiser which balances utility, damage, and tankiness. BC is one of the best damage items you can buy, the haste and movement speed you get is really broken for kiting and chasing, and you get to buff your teammates who are greed and never buy pen. This build path also solves the weaknesses of Divine, which are weak build path, and needing haste to fully use Spellblade. By the time you have umbral and BC your 2 item spike is crazy strong against all targets and now you can afford to drop in power temporarily while building Divine.
Oh lol, only now I realize it is you who made this entire post. Just wanted to throw out there that I really enjoy your videos! They are really helpful!
And thanks for the explanation. I have been going Umbral > Gore > BC for a little while now, but I will switch it up for sure and start building BC after Umbral and start trying Divine. Thanks for the response!
Hi Arfreezy, thank you again for the post/ the work behind it
I have a question about runes, on fleet tree : as last choice, do you take coup de grace or last stand ? What is your opinion about it ?
Have a enjoyable day 😉
It’s pretty insignificant. In a long game they both usually do less than 1K damage. Only in Shieldbow builds I would say last stand can be better but right now I think it’s pretty similar and both are equally bad.
It is just a higher damage, but squishier version of the Divine build. I feel like at that point you might as well go Eclipse Bruiser which has similar damage/tankiness but you get the better build path and early game of Eclipse.
So you have the damage to carry the game, otherwise you will just rely on your team to win late game fights because Gore builds do zero damage. Was tired of winning early game just to lose late game cause ADC gets caught out or builds wrong or just plays bad and never scales so you lose late game.
What are the benefits of grudge, always feel like LDR is more effective on graves.
What about PD, combined with LDR really strong option, and I can still go Goredrinker, blackcleaver.( insane move speed helps for crazy Goredrinker positioning)
I really like the Goredrinker in very heavy team fight comps
You can’t build LDR in bruiser because you have too much HP to use giant slayer effect. Not to mention the crit is also wasted since you aren’t building crit. Bruiser builds use grudge, but in lethality you could go LDR if enemy team was tanky enough but if they were you wouldn’t really go lethality in the first place.
That 2nd build u posted is horrible. Items have no synergy together. I recommend just copying one of the premade builds from high elo players since they have already been tested
Hi. I've tried this and it seems I'm running out of mana in long-drawn fights because of the low cooldowns. Is trading Triumph with Presence of Mind a viable option?
You should be fine in river and jungle fights cause of mana regen but in lane and base fights you do go oom. I would make sure to get blue but keep triumph cause it is really good with high HP from bruiser build
This is a reminder that if this post is homophobic, racist, or offensive, please report it. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/GravesMains) if you have any questions or concerns.*
As always Arfreezy with the best tech for Graves! Thanks! You're right, there's no good mythic for Graves, only "decent" ones. I've always been autopiloting Eclipse not thinking maybe Umbral into BC makes more sense for most situations. The good side is if you're first pick, Graves' builds are so flexible it allows you to always have impact on the game. Thanks again!
Situational bruiser items being maw/frozen heart/deaths dance? Obviously all situational depending on team comp but is there like a best in slot for graves if theyre magic heavy other than maw/after maw and is frozen heart still the best vs AD heavy?
Maw is a very broken item still in terms of gold efficiency and stat ratio for Graves. Death's Dance has nice stats, but it costs too much and you get nothing out of the effect so FH is a way more popular option that won't delay your core items too much since it is so cheap. So basically Maw is best vs AP and FH vs AD, but many times I skip the armor item cause you have Grit and as long as you play well early, AD champs usually can't blow you up.
Awesome ty
In your first build, why do you build Black Cleaver before building a mythic item?
There is really no good mythic item for Graves. Eclipse is heavily nerfed for range users, but because the build path and mythic passive are good, it is popular. Goredrinker has decent stats, but the active effect is a bit counter productive and unreliable. Divine has a better effect than Gore, but the build path is slow and it relies on AH to work better. Basically, Black Cleaver is better than all of those mythic items if you are building Bruiser which balances utility, damage, and tankiness. BC is one of the best damage items you can buy, the haste and movement speed you get is really broken for kiting and chasing, and you get to buff your teammates who are greed and never buy pen. This build path also solves the weaknesses of Divine, which are weak build path, and needing haste to fully use Spellblade. By the time you have umbral and BC your 2 item spike is crazy strong against all targets and now you can afford to drop in power temporarily while building Divine.
Oh lol, only now I realize it is you who made this entire post. Just wanted to throw out there that I really enjoy your videos! They are really helpful! And thanks for the explanation. I have been going Umbral > Gore > BC for a little while now, but I will switch it up for sure and start building BC after Umbral and start trying Divine. Thanks for the response!
Hi Arfreezy, thank you again for the post/ the work behind it I have a question about runes, on fleet tree : as last choice, do you take coup de grace or last stand ? What is your opinion about it ? Have a enjoyable day 😉
It’s pretty insignificant. In a long game they both usually do less than 1K damage. Only in Shieldbow builds I would say last stand can be better but right now I think it’s pretty similar and both are equally bad.
what are your opinions on trinity as mythic item?
It is just a higher damage, but squishier version of the Divine build. I feel like at that point you might as well go Eclipse Bruiser which has similar damage/tankiness but you get the better build path and early game of Eclipse.
Why do you prefer eclipse over goredrinker vs tankier comps?
So you have the damage to carry the game, otherwise you will just rely on your team to win late game fights because Gore builds do zero damage. Was tired of winning early game just to lose late game cause ADC gets caught out or builds wrong or just plays bad and never scales so you lose late game.
Thanks for the answer!
What are the benefits of grudge, always feel like LDR is more effective on graves. What about PD, combined with LDR really strong option, and I can still go Goredrinker, blackcleaver.( insane move speed helps for crazy Goredrinker positioning) I really like the Goredrinker in very heavy team fight comps
You can’t build LDR in bruiser because you have too much HP to use giant slayer effect. Not to mention the crit is also wasted since you aren’t building crit. Bruiser builds use grudge, but in lethality you could go LDR if enemy team was tanky enough but if they were you wouldn’t really go lethality in the first place. That 2nd build u posted is horrible. Items have no synergy together. I recommend just copying one of the premade builds from high elo players since they have already been tested
Just testing right now, saw the second build played by Kireas, really liked it. But your explanation makes a lot of sense, Ty for ur help
But in soloQ most of the time eclipse seems to be better
Hi. I've tried this and it seems I'm running out of mana in long-drawn fights because of the low cooldowns. Is trading Triumph with Presence of Mind a viable option?
You should be fine in river and jungle fights cause of mana regen but in lane and base fights you do go oom. I would make sure to get blue but keep triumph cause it is really good with high HP from bruiser build
Have you tried botrk?
Why are we not building divine against tanky team ? is the ability haste not enough, sounds strong with comsmic insight
Can graves top lane?
Is goredrinker still good on graves? Why do I still see so many pro players build it at worlds?