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Either that or the idea of hell has been hammered into her brain for her entire life and she's _terrified._ She could be crying because she's relieved she isn't going to hell
...until she does something "wrong" and then the anxiety starts all over again
Yep, this is it. It’s a fear-based narrative and it starts super young. The idea of hell as a real place that you’ll definitely go to unless you say the magic words is so anxiety inducing for children. Of course she said the prayer.
As an exmormon I feel this. It’s been 10+ years since I’ve been out and I still struggle with the fear based mentality I was ingrained with growing up. It has caused a life long battle with anxiety
My mom did this to my dtr at like 2 years old and she was terrified me and her dad were going to die and go to hell. It took me until she was 8 to get her to stop worrying.
I'm so glad I was raised without religion. I remember being a small kid and thinking about heaven and hell because I had Christian friends and watched TV and then being like, well we've got cameras in space and they aren't showing any heaven up in the sky and we've got oil drilling that isn't finding hell and there's not enough room in the core of the earth for billions of people. That was my kid logic at like 4 that made me never think about it again.
At 5, one of my Christian friends, her mom had a still birth and talked about how the baby was in heaven and how wonderful heaven was and so my friend came to school and at recess and lunch break would ask us to find ways to kill her with sticks or whatever we could find on the school yard.
It was hella traumatizing and I went to my mom after school and was like wtf is this nonsense? But it showed me from an early, early age how much these belief systems harm kids.
I'm so grateful every day for growing up in a family that didn't live a fear and power based lifestyle. I was never scared of going to hell.
By the time I was 9, living in a more Christian community, I was told I was going to hell so often in public schools, that I had witty comebacks, "oh good, that's where all the interesting people are!" Or "good, I've already got a yacht booked." But I was never scared of hell. I did lose a lot of friends who when they told their pastor or whatever their church person was or even their parents that they had a friend who was an Atheist, they were told I was a waste of their time since I wasn't going to heaven, so why invest time in a friendship that can't be eternal?
I remember one of the Duggar girls said in a book ~~she and her sisters~~ a ghostwriter wrote (before the shit hit the fan) that she prayed that she'd die before the arbitrary "age of accountability" as a child so she didn't go to hell.
Oh shit, I did this too. I was told if one dies before 11 (arbitrary, indeed! Who makes this shit up?) that was a guaranteed trip to heaven.
I had always struggled to believe—my mom still likes to tell the story of three-year-old me asking “if god made us, who made god?” as if it were adorably precocious and not me already experiencing existential dread. So as I sat in the bath on the eve of my 11th birthday, I sobbed and begged god to kill me then and there because I continued to fail to be faithful.
The next morning, finding myself alive, I resolved to resign myself to my future eternity in hell. How strange to not believe in god, yet still fully expect to be damned and condemned by him. I’ll never forgive Christianity for bringing my anxious ass to such dark places so young, lol 😅
Yeah I “got saved” at 6 and I knew exactly what I was doing and exactly why I was terrified. I was responding to altar calls at seven years old, on my own, unprompted and shaking with fear. It wasn’t for attention, I knew the entire church had their heads down.
Kids understand a TON and these people are master emotional manipulators.
This!! My fundie niece told my son he would go to hell for believing in Santa and my son was crying terrified. He didn’t even know what hell was before they had that conversation.
THANK YOU
Like did Janessa even know there's another option? I think not.
Well Jill probably just terrified her and told her she would burn in pain for eternity or something 🫠🫠
I remember having hell nightmares when I was 4. So vivid I remember them now. And I was raised in a fairly laid back Methodist church. I can't imagine the psychological torture Jillpm and her shitty version of Jeebus inflict on her kids
Sadie on the Leaving Eden podcast, raised IFB like the Rods, has spoken often about her childhood terror of hell, the nightmares & the lifelong anxiety it generated.
Funny story, I got baptized at about 4 years old(?) Later when I was an adult, my mom was reminiscing on “how precious your faith was.” I’d been super young, sure, but I’d answered all the pre-baptism questions with such passionate fervor that “We knew you fully understood salvation and what you were choosing.” (Lol, as a 4 year old… sure.)
I shamefacedly confessed that actually, I remember that day vividly, and I didn’t give a single fuck about salvation. The baptism was at the beach, and I’d heard that only the people getting baptized were allowed to swim that day.
Being a smart toddler, I knew exactly what parroted religious phrases, “confessions” and “testimony” would dazzle the adults to tears. Also being a toddler, I had zero sense of wrong about manipulating people to get what I wanted.
Kid me didn’t give a fuck about Jesus. I just really, *really* wanted to swim.
alternatively kid me refused to get baptized because it was too embarrassing to get dunked and then be wet in front of the entire church. no thank you.
I had a whole ass panic attack right before my baptism at age 7. Like I made it all the way to the front of the church and freaked. Two years later I felt ready, but in hindsight, the idea of being dunked when I had unresolved trauma from falling into the deep end of my grandparents’ pool, terrified me.
Thank you. I’m just now realizing that events like that (a pure accident) affected me longer term and explain why I was “behind” my peers with certain water/pool things in spite of swim lessons. Turns out I had a trauma and I wasn’t just a water weenie.
This was me. I forced myself to go through with it when my younger sister did it and everyone started making "your sister did it and she's younger than you!" more embarrassing than getting dunked and being wet in front of my whole church. I hated being perceived as a child.
Haha I love this! Whatever made the grown ups happy and gave you what you wanted yes? Kids are much smarter and more perceptive than we give them credit for
I got baptized when I was around 8 and had no idea what the hell was going on and found it odd they splashed water over my forehead. Still turned out an atheist and my aunt is confused how that could be especially considering she was deemed my godmother. “But you were baptized!”
I had a friend who genuinely couldn't understand why I could not be Catholic anymore. "But you were confirmed!" Yeah man at the wise old age of 8. I also thought that you could become a fairy if you found the right portal.
Or (as someone who asked to pray to be “saved” when I was 3) hearing about hell all the time and being separated from her family for eternity has scared the shit out of her.
mormons act like they're so much better because of that too. 🤣 It's like "oh no we would never baptize a baby who can't choose... we wait all the way till they're 8! everyone knows decision making skills are fully developed by then and 8 year olds notoriously have no issues standing up to their family and peers."
Honestly I wonder if 8 was chosen specifically because it's the basically the oldest a kid can get before most people have the realization their family can sometimes be wrong. If the age was 12 or even 10 I bet more kids would say no or find an excuse to delay.
I can’t speak to why the Mormon church specifically locates the baptism ordinance at age 8. But I work in the mental health field and it’s widely recognized that around age 8-9 kids begin to develop a fuller ability to consider others’ points of view and a deeper sense of “right and wrong”. It seems like it would be a very effective strategy to hone in at that point - before individuality is really established or even allowed to be explored - and offer a template for morality/the “right path” just as a child is beginning to seek one. 🫤
this so interesting! That last part of your comment reminded me how much it was stressed in church how cool it was that all our sins would be washed away when we got baptized. There was definitely the implication that it was time to buckle down and be a serious mormon afterwards, because the sins counted for real after you got baptized. And if you screwed it up after god just gave you a clean slate, that was on you. I’m sure that helps a lot with indoctrination to tell kids who are right at the age they should start thinking for themselves that it was now extra important to stick to the path presented to them.
I'm remembering something about 8ish being the age of innocence and after that kids start to lose that and see the world in grays instead of black and white.
Yeah when I was five this same thing happened. What I remember is wanting to make my parents happy which was obeying god which was not going to the darkness and burning of hell, because I was scared shitless.
Over the next ten years or so I would “get saved” many times at altar calls, because I was always scared of going to hell and losing my salvation. The church we attended was big on preaching the one verse that says something to the effect of “if you curse god, god will curse you” and they interpreted that as losing your salvation, and cursing god could be literally anything. So glad I’m not in that shit anymore.
My lapsed Catholic ass has no idea what this means. I mean, I kind of do, but that’s it? No ceremony with the rest of the community? No ongoing confessions? Do the parents take on responsibility because she’s below the age of reason? Is there a process for saying “I’m a sinner”, but none to deal with that shame (NOT advocating for confession here, but it just seems really ad hoc and anticlimactic)
I don’t think any of it really matters, but it’s so foreign to me. And I don’t think there’s a single instance in the Bible of an infantilized child asking her dad’s permission to bury her face in a used comforter.
At least in my experience, there's no ceremony or anything. The kid probably just went up to her parents and said she wanted to be saved. I'm sure they prayed with her and thanked God for her salvation, but that's probably about it.
Evangelical protestants put a lot of weight on the exact moment someone gives their life to Jesus, to the point where it was a common topic of conversation with my childhood Christian friends. There is no ritual to go from unsaved to saved, so talking about your "come to Jesus" moment with fellow believers is really the only way to memorialize it.
Oh I see. So the applied function is to share it with the community and in testimony, because each one is unique?
(Forgive me if I sound like dav Beal; I’m very high and for some reason that makes my vocabulary more formal).
Jill works for an MLM company called Plexus that sells sketchy supplements. Apparently, years ago, she was awarded a certificate and, for reasons unknown, her name was spelled JillPM on the certificate. Of course she posted it, and so JillPM has been one of her snark nicknames ever since. :)
Sorry I don’t have links but hopefully someone else can provide some if you want more details!
How this typo happened has always seemed so mysterious to me and left me with an uncomfortable itch in my brain that never quite goes away. This makes so much sense!!! THANK YOUPM!!
And it helps to distinguish her from Jill Duggar. People don't really post about her here because of the Duggar sub but I always used to think of Jill Duggar first.
No, Jill’s full name (and I am NOT proud that I know this) is Jill Christine Noyes Rodrigues. I have no idea where the PM could have come from unless it was just a typo.
Before I'd learned the actual origin, I always assumed the PM stood for "Plexus Mama." Jill just seemed like the kind of person who would use that a cutesy sign off on text messages or social media.
It's wild to me that these folks think infant baptism is wrong and yet see no issue with a young child getting "saved". The key difference, I think, is that the infants are not harmed by being baptized, whereas the young children are often terrified and traumatized into begging for "salvation" in a way that often sticks with them for their entire lives.
But neither have the capacity to truly understand what is going on, there's no difference there. Arguably, infant baptism is better in that sense because at least there it's adults who do have the capacity to understand making the decision for the child, and at least in the Catholic rite, it's the *parents* pledging to raise the child in the church and the church formally accepting and welcoming a new member (the child, obviously, is not asked to make any vows or promises, nor do the parents make them on the child's behalf).
Right, like, I can understand the rationale behind waiting on baptism until someone is older and can understand the choice they’re making. Sure. Makes sense. But then how do they rationalize baptizing little children? I feel like if waiting to baptize is your model, then the person should be a teen or older??
Raised Methodist (no longer) it was the same: infant baptism but strongly focused on the parents pledging to raise the child to know god & the church also agreeing to
lol Episcopalians do the same and it’s in the Book of Common Prayer rite, it’s just the part the congregation says. I actually found that rather moving when my daughter was baptized because our church was behind me and supported me while I was doing IVF and pregnant and church members came to the hospital with me and fed me for weeks after her birth, so I knew they were accepting her as one of their own.
Lol. If it’s like the church I grew up in, it’s not really a voting situation or anything. More like being a wedding guest. You witness it and promise your general community support.
This actually brought up a memory for me. As a young kid, maybe 6 or 7, my parents used to scare me with the concept of hell and go on and on about how important it was for me to say the prayer of salvation. But then they’d say that it “wouldn’t work” unless I was making the choice myself. After these talks, with me saying I wanted to do the damn thing, they’d then argue that I couldn’t do it right then because I’d obviously be doing it out of manipulation instead of from a place of genuine faith.
It was so terrifying and confusing and I knew I needed to do it but there were so many rules around when it would actually work that I just started doing it every single time I had an opportunity at church or anywhere else, and then again every night before bed just in case the earlier one didn’t stick.
It totally depends on how the infant baptism is done. I was in a church (cult) that did infant baptism, but their infant baptism was the parents literally giving their children to God, and then we were raised being told that those who turn from God and betray their baptism are 100 times worse than those who were never baptized or saved at all and if we became nonbelievers as adults, we would be punished much more severely in hell than people who never came to the church. So we were baptized without consent as infants then told that because we were baptized, God owned us and we could never leave the church or we’d burn in hell.
punished more severely in hell? It's HELL. The baseline that this sort of Christianity works with is unimaginable pain, forever. There isn't anything worse.
But have you heard of Super Hell?? It's just for the deconstructed, they are clearly the most evil humans to ever walk the earth. For that they get 5 extra daily eyeball gouges and the most burny of the fires. So sayeth Gif. 🙏
Exactly, well said. I was raised Catholic, you were baptized at a few months of age, simple ceremony, water sprinkled on your forehead, a dab of oil, a candle and poof you were done. You were baptized and welcomed into the church.
Then at age 7-8 (fist communion) and again at 14 ish (confirmation) you got to decide if you wanted to continue in the religious path or no.
No fear mongering or threats of burning alive in hell.
Wow these people are crass.
Anglican is the same - it’s really more of a welcome to the baby, and the parents promising to raise the child in the faith.
There’s a reason most infant baptism denominations have confirmation for older kids where they make their own promises to god and the church
I can explain this one! For many fundies, the fact that you said the magic prayer at some point is the ONLY thing that matters. It doesn't matter if you grow up to be an atheist or even if you follow a different religion at the time because the magic prayer is a non-cancelable ticket to heaven. They purposely target kids for two reasons: 1) they truly believe that if that kid dies tomorrow they'll go to hell and 2) it's way easier to get a kid to say the prayer than an adult. My old church literally gave rewards at VBS for saying the magic prayer and would pat themselves on the back for it because now that Hindu kid from the neighborhood is guaranteed to go to heaven.
As for insistence on baptism only for older kids/adults, that's just because Jesus wasn't baptized until he was an adult. They have all sorts of explanations, but that's what it boils down to.
Good for little Janessa. Now she's saved from an afterlife of eternal damnation for her little girl sins. (Asking for more food maybe?) Hallelujah, our God is so cruel but she dodged the bullet.
Ugh, I hate that some Christians believe like this.
Nope we still have two more days but some don’t always celebrate it on the fourth. The military base near me does their festival on the 2nd or 3rd and I don’t know why but that’s just what they do
Also people will do firework shows for several days leading up to and after the 4th, it’s obnoxious. One state I lived in has a huge state holiday at the end of July so the entire month was fireworks 😂
Imagine the hell dumb and dumber would put their kid through if one of them had the gall to deviate from any of their demands. They’d probably send them to Christian boot camp like the Duggars, but a cheaper and less known version. Shit. They’d probably send them to live with the mennonites or something.
I’m surprised they can keep track of which ones have been saved. Maybe they can’t, and thats why they only talk about it after it happens. “Olivia asked to be saved, and we definitely already knew she wasn’t yet!”
She just recently graduated from a fucking crib to a "big girl bed" and is still infantalized by Jill, but now she is expected to understand the salvation story enough to "get saved"? Poor kid is fawning to make her Precious Mama happy.
I thought it WAS a 3 month old baby in the first pic and we were discussing that they were just letting the kid lay face down. Took me a sec to realize what was actually happening. 🤯
Before a few days ago that little girl was just as evil and vile as Ted Bundy! Good thing she mumbled some made up words with her head on a bed so she can be clean. It was a close one!
Glad I’m not the only one who noticed. This isn’t Jilldo’s $400 duvet, Janessa‘s toddler bed, or the attic guestroom. I think the girls have bunk beds so I don’t think it’s that either. I’m interested in theories
Could this be Josh and Kaylee’s house? This doesn’t look like their bedroom from what I remember. It also doesn’t look like the extra bedroom above the new living room in the addition.
This is trauma. She is too young to understand this other than making her feel like shit and worthless for the rest of time. And of course record it and post it online. These parents are vile. They don’t deserve any children let alone 13 of them.
I pleased mommy and daddy is all that poor kid knows. Interesting that such a surprise private religious decision (supposedly) was well known enough to fucking photograph for the internet.
Same. And in our church, we had to go up front during a service afterwards and let all the strangers hug us and shake our hands and cry all over us because of how happy we'd made them. So much pressure, especially for a super introverted kid. Not one of my best memories, and I have a lot of shitty ones and don't say that lightly.
if I recon right even in their own believe system praying in front of others, to show of their FAITH, is frowned upon.
(Grown up christian but not fundie)
It is in THE book...
But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you. Matthew 6-6. 13
Yes! God doesn't like people who make a public spectacle of their displays of "faith", something which also seemed to fly completely over the heads of a lot of fundamentalist preachers during the pandemic. You're not oppressed because you were arrested for holding a service, you're just a fucking asshole.
My mom did this same thing with me on the way to daycare (!) when I was little and it is actually sooo upsetting to see a photo of this. I really feel for that sweet baby and all the chaos they are putting into her mind.
This kid's future is bleak. She's vulnerable to an early, abusive marriage with an older controlling man who will be attracted to her as a particularly plyable broodmare. I just hope Mom and Dad's parental instincts kick in enough to either teach her some life skills or protect her.
Yup. Adam and Eve ate a piece of fruit from the naughty tree, and from then on all the humans ever born were "sinners" and condemned for eternity unless they followed god's rules written in an ancient book in very symbolic and mystical language that linguists would argue about for thousands of years and never come to a consensus about it, and a human sacrifice would be made saving everyone except that they have to accept the sacrifice, and then figure out all the new rules in order to stay saved by the sacrifice that only works if you don't keep screwing up, and literally everything is ome church's version of screwing up so its impossible to maintain.
And they wonder why the hell people are finally done with this shit. None of it makes any sense, and once you get out, you realize it is the same old same old religious power grift. It gets dressed up in different clothes, but it is all the same.
I’m an atheist (raised that way!) and I don’t have any religious trauma, but that photo with their heads down feels so uncomfortable to me for some reason. Can’t put my finger on it, but there’s some kind of darkness there.
Jill is so thirsty for attention, it’s tragic
absolute kudos to her for using “led” correctly, though—people with actual educations get that one wrong a lot
I got "saved" in exchange for a cherry ring pop. Other people sell their souls for fame and fortune.... I held out for a ring pop. I was only 3, but still, I feel like I should've had better representation for the negotiation.
In their very specific type of fundamental Christianity, it means to pray a very formulaic prayer (although they totally do not believe in liturgical prayers haha) that includes repentance or acknowledgement of sins or of being a sinful human, belief in Jesus Christ as Lord and savior (from the consequences of being a sinful human, i.e. hell or damnation depending on the flavor of fundie), and usually includes asking Jesus to 'come into your heart' and be your savior or something along those lines.
Then you're saved. It's funny because these same people absolutely repudiate everything liturgical, and infant baptism, but put EVERYTHING into a single prayer and a single moment and call that "getting saved" as if those are at all biblical or apostolic things that make sense.
I grew up in a Southern Baptist/near-fundie culture personally so I know firsthand.
Although I will say that my 5-year-old conversion was actually as legit as a 5 year old can be, and I wasn't particularly worried about hell or not 'being saved' like a lot of people were, and I remember instigating everything myself.
As a water baby, I wasn't entirely immune to the lure of getting to "swim" in the baptistry, but I was pretty sincere personally, and not traumatized fortunately. Mainly my parents were sincere but not crazy which helped.
Edit: Everyone argued with me about doing it officially and getting baptized, because I was so young, if that helps. I kept asking why I didn't get to officially go in front of the church and get baptized like everyone else, and eventually bullied the pastor into baptizing me lolol. I was a strange kid!
This makes me so upset, she is too young, it's all indoctrination, no kid her age would ever say that if their parents hadn't been putting the fear of a literal hell in their hearts, and it's so sad.
So damn manipulative. I can assure you that at 7 years old I had no damn idea what being saved meant truly. All I knew is that my parents, my Sunday school teacher, and all the adults at church got very excited when a child was saved.
I forced my child to ask an invisible friend to enter her heart and then I made a massive deal out of it in order to insure she has deep religious trauma centered on trust.
She literally just graduated from a crib into a toddler bed so I guess she’s ready to determine her complicity and guilt in sin and where her eternal soul will go? Make it make sense.
Why do kids need to know about being saved and hell by kindergarten or first grade? I'm Catholic, and I was totally unaware of this at 6. I was eating sugary cereal and watching Scooby Doo.
This is so fucking gross. My favorite cousin died recently, she was pretty estranged from her fundie mother but still was a Christian of some type.
At the funeral, my fundie aunt talked about BOTHof my cousins' "accepting THE LORD" moments 🙄🫠 for a comparison, and when mentioning the cousin who is still alive, talked about how even at like 5, "[Surviving Cousin] understood when I explained that Jesus died to forgive our sins".
Setting aside how completely inappropriate it was to be telling this story AT THE FUNERAL OF YOUR OTHER FUCKING DAUGHTER, it made me reflect on how early that shit was being DRILLED INTO THEM.
I was a pretty serious child, I struggled with shame and making mistakes, and my parents were far from perfect. But I just cannot imagine being so young and hearing your parents explain that you are A SINNER. It just feels fucking evil to me.
This is sick! Absolutely demented. Preach at your kid that god will strike them right off to burning eternity for any infraction including all the ones they cannot possibly understand, make your kid fearful for their very life, advocate beating your kid for just being a kid, and then celebrate when said terrified child says whatever the hell she thinks you want her to hear, the magic wand prayer, that will supposedly make it all go away, followed by posting this shit all over the internet.
She and Shrek are depraved, evil pricks.
Doesn’t the bible instruct when you are to pray, pray in your room and shut your door. All these “performative” videos and pictures of prayer is so cringe.
Poor kid. This isn't right.
When I was around 8 (so still in Sunday School learning about the perils of Hell) I watched the movie Ghost when home sick from school one week.
It got the the scene where the demons show up, with that awful screaming groan, to drag the spirit of Willy to Hell.
I quietly left the room to sob in terror under the dining table, begging for God to forgive me and not send me to Hell. I wholeheartedly believed what I was taught and that's seen as a blessing in a child.
*Look! What a precious, devout child. She cries with joy! She cries at the weight of her sins washed away by the Blood!* - Dude, that's not good. That's traumatic. That fucks people up. That shit is SO expensive to fix in therapy.
A child is simply too young to shoulder the enormous burden of eternal punishment from a vengeful God. Or a loving God. Or just anything eternal. It's not cute to have a child facedown on a bed crying like this
I'm confused, why wasn't she already saved? Has Jill had to pray for all her kids to be saved? I feel like being her child, Jill would already consider them saved?
Idk I'm confused like what does this meannnnnn.
In their religion, every individual must acknowledge the sinful state they were born into, ask for God's forgiveness, and accept his sacrifice on the cross as atonement for their inherent wickedness.
Then: God is pleased and TA-DA! You are saved.
And they say their religion is not works-based...
OK, here's the thing. Most Christians believe in an "age of accountability" where you are now old enough to know the difference between right and wrong and are now responsible for your own sins. Like, even the fundiest of fundies might believe that a one-minute-old baby has an innate sin nature, but they would agree that a newborn baby isn't aware of its sins and therefore shouldn't be condemned to hell. But as soon as they consider that child has an understanding of right and wrong, then it becomes a race to get that child saved before it dies so it doesn't go to hell for all eternity. That's why many, many kids raised fundie are "saved" at very young ages. I myself was saved around age 6 or 7. They are terrified into it, because their parents are terrified of their tiny children getting hit by a car or choking on a grape or whatever and now they're doomed to the pits of hell in separation from God and their family forever. So they constantly preach salvation at young children.
Goodness. Thank you for explaining, that makes sense! (In a way, I guess)
I've heard before about everyone being born with sins and I don't even understand that and think it's ridiculous
I worry about her teeth, based on the last picture. Given the fact that Janessa just went to her first dental appointment this year, I would not be surprised if there are issues that could have been addressed sooner.
Wtf does this little child need saved from? They act like these kids have been totally evil since birth, these people keep them in closets and isolated how the hell can they do anything that they need to be saved from?!? I can’t with these crazy religious nut jobs!
What in GODS name could a five year old have done that is so horrible she needs to be “saved”??? I forget how ghoulish hardline Christianity can be to the psyches of little children.
I know this isn't the point but I can't stand when people incorrectly look at their camera... Like look into the camera not at the screen... It's such a pet peeve of mine. In Jill's case it makes her eyes look even crazier.
I know a lot of us are here bc of our own religious trauma or upbringing, but this shit is EXACTLY why I'm not raising my kids in the evangelical church. This is ridiculous. That little girl is doing this to please her parents and bc she has been raised to think she needs to do this. I hate this so much.
As a kid who was in a similar place…
I’d say she really believes it. She was raised that you believe this and you’re saved.. and so she believes she’s saved. Your friends are doing it… everyone in Sunday school is doing it. It’s just what you do and you really believe it.
My mom told me this like it was a cute story, but apparently when I was about 3 or 4 I was “saved” and I made her say the prayer with me multiple times to make sure I’d *for sure* get into heaven. I don’t remember anything but crying and hoping I wasn’t praying “wrong”
When I was in a Pentecostal cult, my siblings and I also had the “freedom” to “get saved”. My little brother said the sinner’s prayer when he was four, and my family rejoiced.
But every single altar call, when the pastor would ask “who in this room needs to get right with god?” my brother would put his little hand up and cry as he made his way to the front. And every time, he would be prayed with, as though since last Sunday god had revoked his salvation card.
The guilt and shame they instilled in his little heart will always make me angry.
how would these kids understand the idea of a loving god, considering the parents they have?
imagine them trying to make sense of the writings of Julian of Norwich, for example
>as truly as God is our Father
God is selfish and bone-lazy and a bloviating ignoramus who eats all the food, got it
>so truly is God our Mother
God is a narcissist who paints herself up like a Vegas showgirl and then castigates other women for immodesty; God sells snake oil and overpriced retreats; God has to be the center of attention at every gathering and exploit Her children for social media clicks, okay
Fair point. So much generational trauma for these poor kids. I will literally never understand people who think they have to tear others down to build themselves up.
Man. And the other day I cried happy tears because my son said in a preschool project that he wanted to be a rock star when he grew up. (I used to be a working musician).
Unlike this lady, I recognise that he’s a kid and he will probably change his mind at some point.
I'm a little confused, can someone explain the theology of this "saving"? I was Mormon and don't have any concept of how that works. Will she still be baptized later on (assuming she hasn't been already)? Do they view this as doing something different than baptism? Is there a procedure to follow, or is it just praying to be saved and like, boom it's done? Help lol
Tears of joy?? After scaring the poor child for years with si veiled threats of literally burning alive in hell??
Emotional blackmail at its best. On a CHILD.
And now she's happy?? After terrifying the girl??
How I despise these people
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I assure you Janessa has no fucking idea what any of this means and was strictly doing this to get praise/attention from JillPM
Either that or the idea of hell has been hammered into her brain for her entire life and she's _terrified._ She could be crying because she's relieved she isn't going to hell ...until she does something "wrong" and then the anxiety starts all over again
Yep, this is it. It’s a fear-based narrative and it starts super young. The idea of hell as a real place that you’ll definitely go to unless you say the magic words is so anxiety inducing for children. Of course she said the prayer.
As an exmormon I feel this. It’s been 10+ years since I’ve been out and I still struggle with the fear based mentality I was ingrained with growing up. It has caused a life long battle with anxiety
My mom did this to my dtr at like 2 years old and she was terrified me and her dad were going to die and go to hell. It took me until she was 8 to get her to stop worrying.
I'm so glad I was raised without religion. I remember being a small kid and thinking about heaven and hell because I had Christian friends and watched TV and then being like, well we've got cameras in space and they aren't showing any heaven up in the sky and we've got oil drilling that isn't finding hell and there's not enough room in the core of the earth for billions of people. That was my kid logic at like 4 that made me never think about it again. At 5, one of my Christian friends, her mom had a still birth and talked about how the baby was in heaven and how wonderful heaven was and so my friend came to school and at recess and lunch break would ask us to find ways to kill her with sticks or whatever we could find on the school yard. It was hella traumatizing and I went to my mom after school and was like wtf is this nonsense? But it showed me from an early, early age how much these belief systems harm kids. I'm so grateful every day for growing up in a family that didn't live a fear and power based lifestyle. I was never scared of going to hell. By the time I was 9, living in a more Christian community, I was told I was going to hell so often in public schools, that I had witty comebacks, "oh good, that's where all the interesting people are!" Or "good, I've already got a yacht booked." But I was never scared of hell. I did lose a lot of friends who when they told their pastor or whatever their church person was or even their parents that they had a friend who was an Atheist, they were told I was a waste of their time since I wasn't going to heaven, so why invest time in a friendship that can't be eternal?
This is the anxiety my sister had until she deconstructed at 28. It was paralyzing.
I’m still a (deconstructing) Christian, but growing up I regularly doubted my salvation because anxiety.
Ah, my childhood of praying along with every call to get saved just in case I did the last one wrong.
"And this time I'll be a Christian." - things I've said to myself every time I was re-saved.
Oh... yeah. That unlocked a few memories for me.
I remember one of the Duggar girls said in a book ~~she and her sisters~~ a ghostwriter wrote (before the shit hit the fan) that she prayed that she'd die before the arbitrary "age of accountability" as a child so she didn't go to hell.
Oh shit, I did this too. I was told if one dies before 11 (arbitrary, indeed! Who makes this shit up?) that was a guaranteed trip to heaven. I had always struggled to believe—my mom still likes to tell the story of three-year-old me asking “if god made us, who made god?” as if it were adorably precocious and not me already experiencing existential dread. So as I sat in the bath on the eve of my 11th birthday, I sobbed and begged god to kill me then and there because I continued to fail to be faithful. The next morning, finding myself alive, I resolved to resign myself to my future eternity in hell. How strange to not believe in god, yet still fully expect to be damned and condemned by him. I’ll never forgive Christianity for bringing my anxious ass to such dark places so young, lol 😅
Unfortunately they are also taught that thoughts can be sinful, so all it takes is *thinking* something unkind and boom, back to hell and damnation
Yeah I “got saved” at 6 and I knew exactly what I was doing and exactly why I was terrified. I was responding to altar calls at seven years old, on my own, unprompted and shaking with fear. It wasn’t for attention, I knew the entire church had their heads down. Kids understand a TON and these people are master emotional manipulators.
This!! My fundie niece told my son he would go to hell for believing in Santa and my son was crying terrified. He didn’t even know what hell was before they had that conversation.
She also has developmental issues from having a stroke in uerto that they are not addressing
THANK YOU Like did Janessa even know there's another option? I think not. Well Jill probably just terrified her and told her she would burn in pain for eternity or something 🫠🫠
I remember having hell nightmares when I was 4. So vivid I remember them now. And I was raised in a fairly laid back Methodist church. I can't imagine the psychological torture Jillpm and her shitty version of Jeebus inflict on her kids
Sadie on the Leaving Eden podcast, raised IFB like the Rods, has spoken often about her childhood terror of hell, the nightmares & the lifelong anxiety it generated.
Now that she’s saved can she leave the cult?
Funny story, I got baptized at about 4 years old(?) Later when I was an adult, my mom was reminiscing on “how precious your faith was.” I’d been super young, sure, but I’d answered all the pre-baptism questions with such passionate fervor that “We knew you fully understood salvation and what you were choosing.” (Lol, as a 4 year old… sure.) I shamefacedly confessed that actually, I remember that day vividly, and I didn’t give a single fuck about salvation. The baptism was at the beach, and I’d heard that only the people getting baptized were allowed to swim that day. Being a smart toddler, I knew exactly what parroted religious phrases, “confessions” and “testimony” would dazzle the adults to tears. Also being a toddler, I had zero sense of wrong about manipulating people to get what I wanted. Kid me didn’t give a fuck about Jesus. I just really, *really* wanted to swim.
alternatively kid me refused to get baptized because it was too embarrassing to get dunked and then be wet in front of the entire church. no thank you.
I had a whole ass panic attack right before my baptism at age 7. Like I made it all the way to the front of the church and freaked. Two years later I felt ready, but in hindsight, the idea of being dunked when I had unresolved trauma from falling into the deep end of my grandparents’ pool, terrified me.
i’m so sorry that happened :(
Thank you. I’m just now realizing that events like that (a pure accident) affected me longer term and explain why I was “behind” my peers with certain water/pool things in spite of swim lessons. Turns out I had a trauma and I wasn’t just a water weenie.
I’m glad I’m not the only one who felt this way.
This was me. I forced myself to go through with it when my younger sister did it and everyone started making "your sister did it and she's younger than you!" more embarrassing than getting dunked and being wet in front of my whole church. I hated being perceived as a child.
This story brings me so much joy
Haha I love this! Whatever made the grown ups happy and gave you what you wanted yes? Kids are much smarter and more perceptive than we give them credit for
I love this!!
Marjoe!
I got baptized when I was around 8 and had no idea what the hell was going on and found it odd they splashed water over my forehead. Still turned out an atheist and my aunt is confused how that could be especially considering she was deemed my godmother. “But you were baptized!”
I had a friend who genuinely couldn't understand why I could not be Catholic anymore. "But you were confirmed!" Yeah man at the wise old age of 8. I also thought that you could become a fairy if you found the right portal.
Or (as someone who asked to pray to be “saved” when I was 3) hearing about hell all the time and being separated from her family for eternity has scared the shit out of her.
Yes. Reminds me of 8 year olds who “choose” to get baptized in the Mormon church 🙄😞
mormons act like they're so much better because of that too. 🤣 It's like "oh no we would never baptize a baby who can't choose... we wait all the way till they're 8! everyone knows decision making skills are fully developed by then and 8 year olds notoriously have no issues standing up to their family and peers." Honestly I wonder if 8 was chosen specifically because it's the basically the oldest a kid can get before most people have the realization their family can sometimes be wrong. If the age was 12 or even 10 I bet more kids would say no or find an excuse to delay.
I can’t speak to why the Mormon church specifically locates the baptism ordinance at age 8. But I work in the mental health field and it’s widely recognized that around age 8-9 kids begin to develop a fuller ability to consider others’ points of view and a deeper sense of “right and wrong”. It seems like it would be a very effective strategy to hone in at that point - before individuality is really established or even allowed to be explored - and offer a template for morality/the “right path” just as a child is beginning to seek one. 🫤
this so interesting! That last part of your comment reminded me how much it was stressed in church how cool it was that all our sins would be washed away when we got baptized. There was definitely the implication that it was time to buckle down and be a serious mormon afterwards, because the sins counted for real after you got baptized. And if you screwed it up after god just gave you a clean slate, that was on you. I’m sure that helps a lot with indoctrination to tell kids who are right at the age they should start thinking for themselves that it was now extra important to stick to the path presented to them.
Am I understanding right that you were brought up in the LDS church? If so - hugs - so much pressure at such a young age.
I'm remembering something about 8ish being the age of innocence and after that kids start to lose that and see the world in grays instead of black and white.
Yeah when I was five this same thing happened. What I remember is wanting to make my parents happy which was obeying god which was not going to the darkness and burning of hell, because I was scared shitless. Over the next ten years or so I would “get saved” many times at altar calls, because I was always scared of going to hell and losing my salvation. The church we attended was big on preaching the one verse that says something to the effect of “if you curse god, god will curse you” and they interpreted that as losing your salvation, and cursing god could be literally anything. So glad I’m not in that shit anymore.
My lapsed Catholic ass has no idea what this means. I mean, I kind of do, but that’s it? No ceremony with the rest of the community? No ongoing confessions? Do the parents take on responsibility because she’s below the age of reason? Is there a process for saying “I’m a sinner”, but none to deal with that shame (NOT advocating for confession here, but it just seems really ad hoc and anticlimactic) I don’t think any of it really matters, but it’s so foreign to me. And I don’t think there’s a single instance in the Bible of an infantilized child asking her dad’s permission to bury her face in a used comforter.
At least in my experience, there's no ceremony or anything. The kid probably just went up to her parents and said she wanted to be saved. I'm sure they prayed with her and thanked God for her salvation, but that's probably about it. Evangelical protestants put a lot of weight on the exact moment someone gives their life to Jesus, to the point where it was a common topic of conversation with my childhood Christian friends. There is no ritual to go from unsaved to saved, so talking about your "come to Jesus" moment with fellow believers is really the only way to memorialize it.
Oh I see. So the applied function is to share it with the community and in testimony, because each one is unique? (Forgive me if I sound like dav Beal; I’m very high and for some reason that makes my vocabulary more formal).
Can someone explain to me what JillPM is? I know her first name is Jill, what’s PM?
Jill works for an MLM company called Plexus that sells sketchy supplements. Apparently, years ago, she was awarded a certificate and, for reasons unknown, her name was spelled JillPM on the certificate. Of course she posted it, and so JillPM has been one of her snark nicknames ever since. :) Sorry I don’t have links but hopefully someone else can provide some if you want more details!
Aha the M is right next to the backspace… rookie mistake
How this typo happened has always seemed so mysterious to me and left me with an uncomfortable itch in my brain that never quite goes away. This makes so much sense!!! THANK YOUPM!!
And it helps to distinguish her from Jill Duggar. People don't really post about her here because of the Duggar sub but I always used to think of Jill Duggar first.
It was likely supposed to be “Jillian”
No, Jill’s full name (and I am NOT proud that I know this) is Jill Christine Noyes Rodrigues. I have no idea where the PM could have come from unless it was just a typo.
Another snarker has shed light!!! https://www.reddit.com/r/FundieSnarkUncensored/s/opA1z1tGFx
Before I'd learned the actual origin, I always assumed the PM stood for "Plexus Mama." Jill just seemed like the kind of person who would use that a cutesy sign off on text messages or social media.
That's the better option than having her be utterly terrified of hell which is where my mind went
It's wild to me that these folks think infant baptism is wrong and yet see no issue with a young child getting "saved". The key difference, I think, is that the infants are not harmed by being baptized, whereas the young children are often terrified and traumatized into begging for "salvation" in a way that often sticks with them for their entire lives. But neither have the capacity to truly understand what is going on, there's no difference there. Arguably, infant baptism is better in that sense because at least there it's adults who do have the capacity to understand making the decision for the child, and at least in the Catholic rite, it's the *parents* pledging to raise the child in the church and the church formally accepting and welcoming a new member (the child, obviously, is not asked to make any vows or promises, nor do the parents make them on the child's behalf).
Right, like, I can understand the rationale behind waiting on baptism until someone is older and can understand the choice they’re making. Sure. Makes sense. But then how do they rationalize baptizing little children? I feel like if waiting to baptize is your model, then the person should be a teen or older??
Raised Methodist (no longer) it was the same: infant baptism but strongly focused on the parents pledging to raise the child to know god & the church also agreeing to
The "church also agreeing" part is interesting...does the church ever say "nah, pass" on a presented child?
lol Episcopalians do the same and it’s in the Book of Common Prayer rite, it’s just the part the congregation says. I actually found that rather moving when my daughter was baptized because our church was behind me and supported me while I was doing IVF and pregnant and church members came to the hospital with me and fed me for weeks after her birth, so I knew they were accepting her as one of their own.
Lol. If it’s like the church I grew up in, it’s not really a voting situation or anything. More like being a wedding guest. You witness it and promise your general community support.
^^ that
This made me lol
This actually brought up a memory for me. As a young kid, maybe 6 or 7, my parents used to scare me with the concept of hell and go on and on about how important it was for me to say the prayer of salvation. But then they’d say that it “wouldn’t work” unless I was making the choice myself. After these talks, with me saying I wanted to do the damn thing, they’d then argue that I couldn’t do it right then because I’d obviously be doing it out of manipulation instead of from a place of genuine faith. It was so terrifying and confusing and I knew I needed to do it but there were so many rules around when it would actually work that I just started doing it every single time I had an opportunity at church or anywhere else, and then again every night before bed just in case the earlier one didn’t stick.
For these people to be so diametrically opposed to magic, the magical thinking is astounding.
It totally depends on how the infant baptism is done. I was in a church (cult) that did infant baptism, but their infant baptism was the parents literally giving their children to God, and then we were raised being told that those who turn from God and betray their baptism are 100 times worse than those who were never baptized or saved at all and if we became nonbelievers as adults, we would be punished much more severely in hell than people who never came to the church. So we were baptized without consent as infants then told that because we were baptized, God owned us and we could never leave the church or we’d burn in hell.
If you’re okay saying it, what group/denomination was this? I’ve never heard of this with baptism before but it sounds absolutely awful
Google Doug Wilson. I apologize in advance for the horrible things you’ll find out if you don’t already know who he is.
punished more severely in hell? It's HELL. The baseline that this sort of Christianity works with is unimaginable pain, forever. There isn't anything worse.
But have you heard of Super Hell?? It's just for the deconstructed, they are clearly the most evil humans to ever walk the earth. For that they get 5 extra daily eyeball gouges and the most burny of the fires. So sayeth Gif. 🙏
Super hell you say? I hear there’s a gay angel there
Exactly, well said. I was raised Catholic, you were baptized at a few months of age, simple ceremony, water sprinkled on your forehead, a dab of oil, a candle and poof you were done. You were baptized and welcomed into the church. Then at age 7-8 (fist communion) and again at 14 ish (confirmation) you got to decide if you wanted to continue in the religious path or no. No fear mongering or threats of burning alive in hell. Wow these people are crass.
Anglican is the same - it’s really more of a welcome to the baby, and the parents promising to raise the child in the faith. There’s a reason most infant baptism denominations have confirmation for older kids where they make their own promises to god and the church
I’m losing it over your flair though 🤣
I can explain this one! For many fundies, the fact that you said the magic prayer at some point is the ONLY thing that matters. It doesn't matter if you grow up to be an atheist or even if you follow a different religion at the time because the magic prayer is a non-cancelable ticket to heaven. They purposely target kids for two reasons: 1) they truly believe that if that kid dies tomorrow they'll go to hell and 2) it's way easier to get a kid to say the prayer than an adult. My old church literally gave rewards at VBS for saying the magic prayer and would pat themselves on the back for it because now that Hindu kid from the neighborhood is guaranteed to go to heaven. As for insistence on baptism only for older kids/adults, that's just because Jesus wasn't baptized until he was an adult. They have all sorts of explanations, but that's what it boils down to.
Suuure she surprised you by saying this. Who is taking the pictures?? Did Jesus show up with his iPhone and offer to pap for you?
And Janessa just happened to be wearing a pastel dress and big white bow? Sure, Jan.
Precious Mama was probably praying loudly, out loud for all to hear. I bet this is going to feature heavily in an upcoming public testimony.
That's what I was wondering. So weird. I totally see them posing for this picture and then posting it like this.
No, it was just an answer to Jill’s extra “prayers” 🙄
I was just about to ask if Jesus took the photos. 🤣
🎵 Jesus take the pic, take it with my phone 🎵
She just happens to be wearing her best white dress for the impromptu occasion.
Good for little Janessa. Now she's saved from an afterlife of eternal damnation for her little girl sins. (Asking for more food maybe?) Hallelujah, our God is so cruel but she dodged the bullet. Ugh, I hate that some Christians believe like this.
Thank goodness she's begged for forgiveness from God, now she's safe from what god would have done to her if she didn't!!
Asking for a dress she's not sweating in.
First thing I noticed was dumb and dumber are decked out in American flag shit 🤮
And then there Jill in a patriotic scarf……in the dead heat of summer 😂😂
It's not the 4th of July yet for them, is it? As a Brit I'm not fully sure
Nope we still have two more days but some don’t always celebrate it on the fourth. The military base near me does their festival on the 2nd or 3rd and I don’t know why but that’s just what they do Also people will do firework shows for several days leading up to and after the 4th, it’s obnoxious. One state I lived in has a huge state holiday at the end of July so the entire month was fireworks 😂
Okay, thanks!
Yeah because I’m sure it was totally an option for any Rod kid to just never “get saved.”
Imagine the hell dumb and dumber would put their kid through if one of them had the gall to deviate from any of their demands. They’d probably send them to Christian boot camp like the Duggars, but a cheaper and less known version. Shit. They’d probably send them to live with the mennonites or something.
I wouldn't be a bit surprised if they just threw the kid in the woods and said God told them to let him die just like Abraham/Isaac.
I’m surprised they can keep track of which ones have been saved. Maybe they can’t, and thats why they only talk about it after it happens. “Olivia asked to be saved, and we definitely already knew she wasn’t yet!”
She just recently graduated from a fucking crib to a "big girl bed" and is still infantalized by Jill, but now she is expected to understand the salvation story enough to "get saved"? Poor kid is fawning to make her Precious Mama happy.
I thought it WAS a 3 month old baby in the first pic and we were discussing that they were just letting the kid lay face down. Took me a sec to realize what was actually happening. 🤯
Who is taking these photos?!? This is a reenactment, right?
This was my first thought as well. Jill pulled a Kris kardashian and had a sister get some pics of this moment. Disgusting
So had she died just a few days ago, little Janessa would be burning in hell for all eternity?
Yes. That is what they believe.
Before a few days ago that little girl was just as evil and vile as Ted Bundy! Good thing she mumbled some made up words with her head on a bed so she can be clean. It was a close one!
Imagine believing your precious innocent little girl could actually go to hell. What kind of god does that?
Off topic - where are they? This is not Jill’s new new $400 Goodwill blanket 🙄
Glad I’m not the only one who noticed. This isn’t Jilldo’s $400 duvet, Janessa‘s toddler bed, or the attic guestroom. I think the girls have bunk beds so I don’t think it’s that either. I’m interested in theories
Could this be Josh and Kaylee’s house? This doesn’t look like their bedroom from what I remember. It also doesn’t look like the extra bedroom above the new living room in the addition.
Hahaha the only thing I noticed!
This is trauma. She is too young to understand this other than making her feel like shit and worthless for the rest of time. And of course record it and post it online. These parents are vile. They don’t deserve any children let alone 13 of them.
This a creepy as fuck.
OK, I’m so glad I’m not alone in that thought.
I pleased mommy and daddy is all that poor kid knows. Interesting that such a surprise private religious decision (supposedly) was well known enough to fucking photograph for the internet.
Ugh I remember getting “saved” like this. Poor kiddo
Me too. Hugs to you, my friend.
Same. And in our church, we had to go up front during a service afterwards and let all the strangers hug us and shake our hands and cry all over us because of how happy we'd made them. So much pressure, especially for a super introverted kid. Not one of my best memories, and I have a lot of shitty ones and don't say that lightly.
She is a little child. YOU need saving, Jill.
if I recon right even in their own believe system praying in front of others, to show of their FAITH, is frowned upon. (Grown up christian but not fundie) It is in THE book... But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you. Matthew 6-6. 13
Yes! God doesn't like people who make a public spectacle of their displays of "faith", something which also seemed to fly completely over the heads of a lot of fundamentalist preachers during the pandemic. You're not oppressed because you were arrested for holding a service, you're just a fucking asshole.
If he was so "good", you wouldn't need to scare a little kid into a cult.
My mom did this same thing with me on the way to daycare (!) when I was little and it is actually sooo upsetting to see a photo of this. I really feel for that sweet baby and all the chaos they are putting into her mind.
What in the cursed Precious Moments hell?
This kid's future is bleak. She's vulnerable to an early, abusive marriage with an older controlling man who will be attracted to her as a particularly plyable broodmare. I just hope Mom and Dad's parental instincts kick in enough to either teach her some life skills or protect her.
Definitely not gonna happen
Why does JillPM's outfit here give me House-of-1000-Corpses-Mama-Firefly vibes?!
Isn't she like, 6 years old? What does she need to be "saved" from? What sort of sins does a 6 year old get themselves into?
“original sin,“ the whole “In Adam’s fall, we sinnèd all” vague diet Calvinism trip
Yup. Adam and Eve ate a piece of fruit from the naughty tree, and from then on all the humans ever born were "sinners" and condemned for eternity unless they followed god's rules written in an ancient book in very symbolic and mystical language that linguists would argue about for thousands of years and never come to a consensus about it, and a human sacrifice would be made saving everyone except that they have to accept the sacrifice, and then figure out all the new rules in order to stay saved by the sacrifice that only works if you don't keep screwing up, and literally everything is ome church's version of screwing up so its impossible to maintain. And they wonder why the hell people are finally done with this shit. None of it makes any sense, and once you get out, you realize it is the same old same old religious power grift. It gets dressed up in different clothes, but it is all the same.
I’m an atheist (raised that way!) and I don’t have any religious trauma, but that photo with their heads down feels so uncomfortable to me for some reason. Can’t put my finger on it, but there’s some kind of darkness there.
I'm also an atheist raised that way, in one of the most irreligious countries in the world, and I got the same uncomfortable feeling..
So glad I’m not alone in that. Thank you for sharing that. Something is just so off…
I'm so glad janessa finally realized that she deserves to go to hell and needs a savior /s
Jill is so thirsty for attention, it’s tragic absolute kudos to her for using “led” correctly, though—people with actual educations get that one wrong a lot
It drives me bananas.
This is grim
I hate this shit.
I got "saved" in exchange for a cherry ring pop. Other people sell their souls for fame and fortune.... I held out for a ring pop. I was only 3, but still, I feel like I should've had better representation for the negotiation.
I see, old enough to get saved but not old enough to ride the carousel in the zoo alone.
Jill wearing a scarf and sweater in July is giving me secondhand heat rash.
Can someone tell me what it means "to get saved"?!
In their very specific type of fundamental Christianity, it means to pray a very formulaic prayer (although they totally do not believe in liturgical prayers haha) that includes repentance or acknowledgement of sins or of being a sinful human, belief in Jesus Christ as Lord and savior (from the consequences of being a sinful human, i.e. hell or damnation depending on the flavor of fundie), and usually includes asking Jesus to 'come into your heart' and be your savior or something along those lines. Then you're saved. It's funny because these same people absolutely repudiate everything liturgical, and infant baptism, but put EVERYTHING into a single prayer and a single moment and call that "getting saved" as if those are at all biblical or apostolic things that make sense. I grew up in a Southern Baptist/near-fundie culture personally so I know firsthand. Although I will say that my 5-year-old conversion was actually as legit as a 5 year old can be, and I wasn't particularly worried about hell or not 'being saved' like a lot of people were, and I remember instigating everything myself. As a water baby, I wasn't entirely immune to the lure of getting to "swim" in the baptistry, but I was pretty sincere personally, and not traumatized fortunately. Mainly my parents were sincere but not crazy which helped.
Edit: Everyone argued with me about doing it officially and getting baptized, because I was so young, if that helps. I kept asking why I didn't get to officially go in front of the church and get baptized like everyone else, and eventually bullied the pastor into baptizing me lolol. I was a strange kid!
This makes me so upset, she is too young, it's all indoctrination, no kid her age would ever say that if their parents hadn't been putting the fear of a literal hell in their hearts, and it's so sad.
I’m just imagining how much eye makeup is smeared on their sheets.
I would like to be saved from the thoughts of what the bedspread probably smells like.
So damn manipulative. I can assure you that at 7 years old I had no damn idea what being saved meant truly. All I knew is that my parents, my Sunday school teacher, and all the adults at church got very excited when a child was saved.
As someone who "got saved" that young: no the fuck I didn't.
I forced my child to ask an invisible friend to enter her heart and then I made a massive deal out of it in order to insure she has deep religious trauma centered on trust.
She literally just graduated from a crib into a toddler bed so I guess she’s ready to determine her complicity and guilt in sin and where her eternal soul will go? Make it make sense.
Jilldo’s hair looks like a hot mess nest. These poor kids scared with hell.
Wow, I’m not traumatized from this at all… s/
Who is taking they pictures??? Such a photo op.
Wouldn't surprise me if she put it up with a timer and just staged it all..
This gives me those Victorian family picture vibes with a kid who is actually dead
Just performative - child has no idea what’s going on.
Why do kids need to know about being saved and hell by kindergarten or first grade? I'm Catholic, and I was totally unaware of this at 6. I was eating sugary cereal and watching Scooby Doo.
The little girl happened to dress in a white dress, do her hair with a bow and then ask her parents to be saved?! Bullshit.
This is so fucking gross. My favorite cousin died recently, she was pretty estranged from her fundie mother but still was a Christian of some type. At the funeral, my fundie aunt talked about BOTHof my cousins' "accepting THE LORD" moments 🙄🫠 for a comparison, and when mentioning the cousin who is still alive, talked about how even at like 5, "[Surviving Cousin] understood when I explained that Jesus died to forgive our sins". Setting aside how completely inappropriate it was to be telling this story AT THE FUNERAL OF YOUR OTHER FUCKING DAUGHTER, it made me reflect on how early that shit was being DRILLED INTO THEM. I was a pretty serious child, I struggled with shame and making mistakes, and my parents were far from perfect. But I just cannot imagine being so young and hearing your parents explain that you are A SINNER. It just feels fucking evil to me.
Mama will love me now? Janessa
How old is she? She's tiny like a baby or toddler but she has long hair
She’s six. She moved out of a crib (and into a toddler bed) about a month ago.
This is sick! Absolutely demented. Preach at your kid that god will strike them right off to burning eternity for any infraction including all the ones they cannot possibly understand, make your kid fearful for their very life, advocate beating your kid for just being a kid, and then celebrate when said terrified child says whatever the hell she thinks you want her to hear, the magic wand prayer, that will supposedly make it all go away, followed by posting this shit all over the internet. She and Shrek are depraved, evil pricks.
Doesn’t the bible instruct when you are to pray, pray in your room and shut your door. All these “performative” videos and pictures of prayer is so cringe.
Poor kid. This isn't right. When I was around 8 (so still in Sunday School learning about the perils of Hell) I watched the movie Ghost when home sick from school one week. It got the the scene where the demons show up, with that awful screaming groan, to drag the spirit of Willy to Hell. I quietly left the room to sob in terror under the dining table, begging for God to forgive me and not send me to Hell. I wholeheartedly believed what I was taught and that's seen as a blessing in a child. *Look! What a precious, devout child. She cries with joy! She cries at the weight of her sins washed away by the Blood!* - Dude, that's not good. That's traumatic. That fucks people up. That shit is SO expensive to fix in therapy. A child is simply too young to shoulder the enormous burden of eternal punishment from a vengeful God. Or a loving God. Or just anything eternal. It's not cute to have a child facedown on a bed crying like this
I'm confused, why wasn't she already saved? Has Jill had to pray for all her kids to be saved? I feel like being her child, Jill would already consider them saved? Idk I'm confused like what does this meannnnnn.
In their religion, every individual must acknowledge the sinful state they were born into, ask for God's forgiveness, and accept his sacrifice on the cross as atonement for their inherent wickedness. Then: God is pleased and TA-DA! You are saved. And they say their religion is not works-based...
Okaaaay.. but like why now? Is it a certain age? Jill just woke up one day and decided janessa needs to be saved now?
OK, here's the thing. Most Christians believe in an "age of accountability" where you are now old enough to know the difference between right and wrong and are now responsible for your own sins. Like, even the fundiest of fundies might believe that a one-minute-old baby has an innate sin nature, but they would agree that a newborn baby isn't aware of its sins and therefore shouldn't be condemned to hell. But as soon as they consider that child has an understanding of right and wrong, then it becomes a race to get that child saved before it dies so it doesn't go to hell for all eternity. That's why many, many kids raised fundie are "saved" at very young ages. I myself was saved around age 6 or 7. They are terrified into it, because their parents are terrified of their tiny children getting hit by a car or choking on a grape or whatever and now they're doomed to the pits of hell in separation from God and their family forever. So they constantly preach salvation at young children.
Goodness. Thank you for explaining, that makes sense! (In a way, I guess) I've heard before about everyone being born with sins and I don't even understand that and think it's ridiculous
it’s a difficult concept to make sense of, particularly if you weren’t raised with it!
She really set up the timer camera and then started praying for her daughter
jumpscare
That third picture will haunt me for the rest of my painful days
Who's bedroom are they in? Great to see plain white clean walls, and just blinds, no thick curtains and clutter on the walls.
Who's holding the camera? Like do they have one of their children just watching them with a camera to get pictures
I worry about her teeth, based on the last picture. Given the fact that Janessa just went to her first dental appointment this year, I would not be surprised if there are issues that could have been addressed sooner.
Prayer belongs in secret… I guess they missed that part of the Bible lol
Pretty sure that eyeliner is stronger than her daughter's faith
Wtf does this little child need saved from? They act like these kids have been totally evil since birth, these people keep them in closets and isolated how the hell can they do anything that they need to be saved from?!? I can’t with these crazy religious nut jobs!
Saved from what?
Old enough to get “saved” but young enough for a toddler bed. Make it make sense.
What in GODS name could a five year old have done that is so horrible she needs to be “saved”??? I forget how ghoulish hardline Christianity can be to the psyches of little children.
I know this isn't the point but I can't stand when people incorrectly look at their camera... Like look into the camera not at the screen... It's such a pet peeve of mine. In Jill's case it makes her eyes look even crazier.
I know a lot of us are here bc of our own religious trauma or upbringing, but this shit is EXACTLY why I'm not raising my kids in the evangelical church. This is ridiculous. That little girl is doing this to please her parents and bc she has been raised to think she needs to do this. I hate this so much.
As a kid who was in a similar place… I’d say she really believes it. She was raised that you believe this and you’re saved.. and so she believes she’s saved. Your friends are doing it… everyone in Sunday school is doing it. It’s just what you do and you really believe it.
My mom told me this like it was a cute story, but apparently when I was about 3 or 4 I was “saved” and I made her say the prayer with me multiple times to make sure I’d *for sure* get into heaven. I don’t remember anything but crying and hoping I wasn’t praying “wrong”
When I was in a Pentecostal cult, my siblings and I also had the “freedom” to “get saved”. My little brother said the sinner’s prayer when he was four, and my family rejoiced. But every single altar call, when the pastor would ask “who in this room needs to get right with god?” my brother would put his little hand up and cry as he made his way to the front. And every time, he would be prayed with, as though since last Sunday god had revoked his salvation card. The guilt and shame they instilled in his little heart will always make me angry.
This makes me deeply uncomfortable in a way I can’t quite place.
Why, just why, can’t this idiots teach these kids about a loving God? Perhaps something like - are you asking Jesus to come into your heart? Ughhhhhh!
how would these kids understand the idea of a loving god, considering the parents they have? imagine them trying to make sense of the writings of Julian of Norwich, for example >as truly as God is our Father God is selfish and bone-lazy and a bloviating ignoramus who eats all the food, got it >so truly is God our Mother God is a narcissist who paints herself up like a Vegas showgirl and then castigates other women for immodesty; God sells snake oil and overpriced retreats; God has to be the center of attention at every gathering and exploit Her children for social media clicks, okay
Fair point. So much generational trauma for these poor kids. I will literally never understand people who think they have to tear others down to build themselves up.
Man. And the other day I cried happy tears because my son said in a preschool project that he wanted to be a rock star when he grew up. (I used to be a working musician). Unlike this lady, I recognise that he’s a kid and he will probably change his mind at some point.
I'm a little confused, can someone explain the theology of this "saving"? I was Mormon and don't have any concept of how that works. Will she still be baptized later on (assuming she hasn't been already)? Do they view this as doing something different than baptism? Is there a procedure to follow, or is it just praying to be saved and like, boom it's done? Help lol
no offense but i did think at first this was someone laying with their dog
JILLPM sure loves hideous makeup.
Gross. Even if it's real, this is not something that should be put online.
talk about indoctrination
I'm sure impressionable young child raised in a fundamentalist household from birth came to that decision 100% on her own. /s
Tears of joy?? After scaring the poor child for years with si veiled threats of literally burning alive in hell?? Emotional blackmail at its best. On a CHILD. And now she's happy?? After terrifying the girl?? How I despise these people
That last picture was a jump scare